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By: Westane, Jeff Torres
Aug 16 2010 12:39am
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More TP Please!

jace, the mind sculptorprimeval titanfauna shamanpyromancer ascension

Well, let's see, I've been writing here for about three months now. Despite a couple potentially debatable articles, I've generally managed to maintain a neutral point of view. As such, I've avoided making many enemies, and in my alternate reality where people like me, people like me. However, I think it's about time I step on some toes, so here we go! I hate the Tournament Practice room. Yeah, okay, fine, lots of people hate the TP room, but my reasons are a little... meaner.

If you're a WoW player like me I can sum up my reason in one simple sentence. The TP room is the MTGO equivalent of Trade Chat.

If you need some clarification, let me help you. If I build a truly competitive deck, well researched and proven viable, I'll naturally seek a medium to further my experience, and in turn skill, with said deck. To do this, I will enter the Tournament Practice room, in which I intend to Practice for Tournaments. It is here I will face off against a competitive meta and hone skills so that I may succeed in a tournament environment.

Not so much.

Like I said, I know I'm going to leave a bad taste in some peoples' mouths, and I'll try to touch on all points. Yes, I may be coming across as an elitist jackass, but I'm okay with that. I understand Magic is a game to be played for fun, and people like me are probably ruining that experience for many people. I also understand that not everyone has the same idea of a competitive environment as I do. While I may be practicing for a PTQ, the guy across from me may be practicing for an FNM. I get that. However, there's a difference between a rogue FNM deck with some level of thought put into it, and a five-color pile running Chandra's Spitfires and Tome Scours! When this happens, I have a choice to make: I can either just end the game so as not to "waste my time", or I can play it out. If I decide to just quit, I'm doing everyone a disservice. Not only did I blatantly stick my nose up at someone for being "inferior", used very loosely, but I denied someone a potential learning experience. They could be sitting there wondering, "What did I do?", and I'm not going to treat people that way.

Alternatively, I play it out and trounce my opponent. I've been to FNM's where I have to play the 10 year old newbie who cries after a game-loss. I don't like being that guy! I have nothing to gain by making some poor guy miserable for the length of the match, and he has little to gain from it happening. Hell, for all I know I could be his last match before he decides to quit! Perhaps I'm over-thinking things, but at least I care, I suppose.

I don't want to spend 6-tix and 3+ hours in a Daily Event every night just to get the kind of practice I'm looking for, especially if I can't maintain my income of tickets. However, the alternative isn't much better. I may sound like I'm being extremely arrogant, but I'm not trying to be. I just think that the New Players, the Casual, and Tournament Practice rooms should be used with maybe just a tad more discretion.

This isn't entirely the players' faults though either. I've seen the Casual room, it's a mess! WotC really needs to make some major improvements on both their UI and their social experience. I wonder if 4.0 will ever actually be released...

Okay, I'm done with my little rant. If you want to keep reading, I commend you, if not, well I understand. I'm not a bad guy! Really!

The Evolution of an Ever Evolving Architecture

wall of omenssun titansphinx of jwar islemana leak

So I may have mentioned I'm playing UW Control at some point recently. No? Well I'm playing UW Control, I'm playing a lot of UW Control. I have made more tweaks and changes to this deck over the last week than any other deck I've ever played online. Ever. In fact, as I'm writing this, the deck is STILL in development and will continue to be until I find reason enough to retire it. I'm going to spend a little time going over what's been learned from so much testing with this deck, and what changes it's gone through.

Playing The Mirror Match Sucks!

Seriously, I hate it. I wont let it show how much I hate it, because it's going to happen often, but I hate it. For this reason I decided to test a full set of Negates in the SB, and 3x Redirects in the MB. Redirect was extremely interesting, and made for some fun situations. In the mirror, it can be a Counterspell when used defensively, shooting down opposing Deprives and Negates. However, it's against Jund where the card truly shines. Being able to throw back Blightning and Maelstrom Pulse is huge, and just about game-ending if the timing's right. However, despite the fun we had together, I had to cut Redirect entirely. The fact that it's useless against Oblivion Ring, Planeswalkers and a number of other relevant non-creature threats is too much. Regardless, I'm happy I have a set in my collection!

 We Have No Bad Match Ups, Except We Do

When I first started playing this deck I felt invincible.Even seemingly bad matches could be turned around and salvaged from the bowels of defeat. I don't quite feel this way anymore. Valakut Titan and Pyromancer Ascension decks are here with a vengeance, and they really seem to like their game against us. I'm still not running Spreading Seas, and I still don't regret it. Any Valakut pilot worth his salt knows how to play against land disruption, so even if I had it it wouldn't be optimal. I'm still learning what I should be countering, and what I can let them have. Do I counter their early ramp and hope they get stuck? Do I give them all the mana they want and hold hard counters for their fatties? What if they're running Autumn's Veil? Valakut's winnable for sure, but I wouldn't say I enjoy playing against it.

When did Pyromancer Ascension become a deck? Where the hell was I? Can I have those Time Warps I sold for 9 tix a piece back? As far as I'm concerned this thing came out of nowhere, and it's damn consistent. I can't believe Preordain made this much of an impact, but here it is. I'm finding this to be quite a tough match, and I'm lucky to win game one. Luckily...

Leyline of Sanctity is a Real Card. Really

Oh. Em. Gee. You may recall I said I wasn't fully sold on this card. Then I started running two of them in the board to test. Now I'm up to a full set in the SB. This card is the real deal folks. It shines against the two decks I mentioned above, and so much more.

  • I've mulled to 2 against Megrim.dec and won, easily.
  • I've forced a RDW player to Lightning Bolt himself just to pump his Kiln Fiend.
  • I mill player learned to hate his own Hedron Crab, after realizing it's not a "may" effect.
  • Said mill player would later cast Haunting Echoes...
  • Eight turn-zero scoops and counting!

I don't recommend mulling for it unless it's extremely important to the matchup and you know they wont be able to deal with it. Leyline of Sanctity is equally valuable whether you cast it turn 0 or turn 4. This card has been enough to make me drop the Kor Firewalkers from my SB, and the ability to safely drop Planeswalkers against burn-packing decks is really great!

So Yeah, Baneslayer Angel's 16 Tix Now...

Initial thought process, "ZOMG Must go buy playset NAO!!!1!11!!!1!1one". After calming down, I reconsidered. BSA is an amazing card, don't get me wrong. How much more mana efficient can you get!? Unfortunately, I'm having an extremely hard time justifying a slot for her. In running limited win conditions, I just can't put a lot of faith in something that doesn't outright win you the game, and dies to nearly every form of removal. However, I also realize that if left unanswered, she WILL win you the game.

I'm starting to abandon my old way of thinking when it comes to creatures, and trying to put more trust in the "Must Answer" attribute some creatures today possess. Fauna Shaman's a good example. As a control player, I see a 2-mana x/2 that takes a whole turn to start doing anything, and potentially dies to everything. Being the way I am though, I have a habit of always assuming my opponent has exactly the answer they need against me. What I need to start working on, is understanding that that's now always the case. If the Naya player untaps with Fauna Shaman, it's pretty much downhill from there. If she's not dealt with immediately, that will be game changing. If I play my Baneslayer Angel and shes Terminated, well oh well. If she's not, I just gained a giant advantage.

War of the Fatties! Sun Titan vs Frost Titan vs Sphinx of Jwar Isle!

I've been making several adjustments to my creature base lately, and am finding myself liking Sun Titan less and less. Sure, he'll more or less win you the game if he sticks, but that's not happening as often as I'd like. Frost Titan was worth a shot, but also proved to be less than stellar. He wasn't "bad", and I actually really like him, but he still wasn't great. I still love Sphinx of Jwar Isle. As it stands, I'm running 2x Sun Titan and 2x SoJI, and it's been working out really well. I've seen lists only running 3x SoJI for creatures, and I honestly don't hate the idea. If I take that route I'll be able to put Gideon back in...

Oh Yeah, I Cut Gideon Jura

Yes, okay, every once in a while he'd come out and steal a game for you. He just didn't do that very often, or at least often enough for me. First I moved him to the SB, then I cut him completely. If I take to playing angels, I may just bring him back, but until then... meh.

 

 

Not that much of a change, but it's actually come a long way in testing. I tried to push more to better handle the meta, but that left too many holes in the deck. I think having this happy balance will just work better for me, as it has in the past. Only time and testing will tell whether or not BSA will make the cut, but they're definitely worth picking up.

Now for something completely unrelated...

Baseless Scars of Mirrodin Speculation!

The artwork used in these cards is not my own, credit goes to their artists. So Scars is just around the corner, with it will come a new meta. Given our Zendikar and M11 card pool I expect U/w control will still flourish, but we'll still have a good few cards rotating out. Here's a very brief look at some of the things I'd love to see come October!

New Set of Artifact Lands

I can fully understand why we wouldn't get a new set of artifact lands proper, but I think with some very minor limitations we can bring in a new cycle of them. Too slow to make Legacy Affinity come blazing out of the gate, but effective enough to add to consistency. I also think that adding basic land subtypes to them can go a long way in helping several decks that would want them, without making them broken.

Imagine how much better Affinity would be if half your lands weren't almost dead half the time. I would love to play UBR Affinity that could fix its mana with fetchlands and never have useless colors. Hell, I might even play Affinity then!

It even fits in with the lore. Who long has it been since we've visited Mirrodin? Surely over time the natural environments have integrated themselves into the metallic landscapes to some degree. This would maintain familiarity but still emphasize story progression.

 

Artifact Dual Lands

As long as we're talking about artifact lands, I always thought having artifact dual lands would be the coolest thing. I think they really got it right in M10 with the dual land cycle, and I'd love to see something playable in Scars. While I'd love to see true dual lands with basic land subtypes, I'll take what I can get.

I think now's the time for enemy colored dual lands to make a comeback as well. Better yet, bring back something similar to the tainted lands from Torment. When I first started playing those were just the best things ever, and it would tie in nicely with the lore of the block.

Again, something like this would be a very nice step forward for Affinity, without breaking it.

Make Aggressive Blue Fun!

I actually really like Fish in Legacy, and had I the Force of Wills I would. Part of the reason is that I've always had a thing for creatures like Spiketail Hatchling, Cursecatcher and Glen Elendra Archmage. I think given the available and potential mechanics, such things could come back.

Despite my taste for heavy permission decks, I really do enjoy playing the aggressive U/x decks that can afford to tap out while still maintaining board control. Were I smart and picked up my Bitterblossoms before they skyrocketed in price, I'd be playing Faeries in Extended right now.

Everyone keeps saying that blue is overpowered, and really it isn't. Yes, I know we have Jace, but he alone does not define blue. I think we could use a few more tricks.

 

Bring Affinity Back, Only Better!

I can't imagine them not bringing back the Affinity mechanic, but I do hope they make some more strategic use of it. Have you ever stopped to think how elegant something like "Affinity for Lands" could be? Take the example to the left: On turn 3 it's unplayable, and Cancel is the better counter. On turn 4 it becomes Cancel, and on turn 5 onwards it is Counterspell.

Something like this adds solid mid-late game utility without breaking the early game.

The concept is very simple, and I believe they never really tapped into what Affinity could become the first time around.

Bring On The Lore!

We know Karn, Elspeth and Tezerret are all making an appearance in some way, shape or form. WotC has taken several steps over the last few expansions to "humanize" the Planeswalkers, adding character and story to them. I love this! With the exception of Urza and Mishra I never cared about any of the Planeswalkers before but Lorwyn really helped change my attitude.

Mirrodin is being corrupted, why not a Planeswalker or two? What a great story arc it would be for Elspeth to fall and for someone as cold as Tezzeret to have to become a hero to this plane. Sure, maybe pushing the new Planeswalkers was really just a marketing ploy from Wizards to make the universe more accessible to new players but dammit I like it!

 I Think I'm Done, Let's See...

Well, this was quite a long-winded and scatterbrained article wasn't it? It really was quite deliberate, and I'll be back on track next week I assure you. Over the coming weekend I'll be playing in 3 DE's as well as a Premiere event... I wonder how many bot credits a divorce is going to cost... Also, I'll not be posting many (if any) UW Control videos. As much as I love them they really are boring. To compensate, I'll be ending each article during the MOC Season with a couple videos of some of my more "out of character" decks.

Until next time!

-Jeff Torres

29 Comments

fun article! by Sirskills at Mon, 08/16/2010 - 10:40
Sirskills's picture

An enjoying read top to bottom. Leyline of Sanctity does seem to be underutilized right now. I was thinking of doing an article this week to see if a deck running blue could be competitive without Jace 2.0 but then realized the pyromancer ascension.dec doesn't so I just answered my own question. I really don't like the ascension.dec, I usually end up losing the game 1 to it but after a good SB walk all over it. Just bring out some enchant hate and graveyard removal.
Your UW control does look powerful and I always dread that matchup. My time seems to be spent putting together decks that don't run blue that can compete with the field AND that matchup.

Yeah, Ascension is one of by Westane at Mon, 08/16/2010 - 11:01
Westane's picture

Yeah, Ascension is one of those "Let's just get it over with..." decks. As for you quest for a JMS-Free zone, I would actually look at Polymorph. A lot of people are afraid to admit it, but Beleren actually fits the curve much better than JMS, and I think functions better for the deck as well.

rating the article by Sirskills at Mon, 08/16/2010 - 08:53
Sirskills's picture
5

rating the article

I don't understand why you by speks at Mon, 08/16/2010 - 10:25
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I don't understand why you are testing UW control for MOCS, i thought MOCS is M11 sealed this season?

1) I still need to actually by Westane at Mon, 08/16/2010 - 10:59
Westane's picture

1) I still need to actually qualify, and Standard is my strongest game right now. Winning = QP's = Playing in the MOC

2) I'm playing in the August 18th - September 15th season, which ends with a Standard tourney and a crappy promo (But that's not the point!)

Not going to lie, I was by runeliger at Mon, 08/16/2010 - 22:04
runeliger's picture

Not going to lie, I was wondering the same thing. Gl with the QPs.

Regarding you opening rant. by lumbydan at Mon, 08/16/2010 - 12:59
lumbydan's picture

Regarding you opening rant. I have been playing for about 8 months now and I have never actually played in the TP room. I Guess I thought everyone in there was running a top deck and would be annoyed that I would come in with my competitive but not overpowering decks. I guess I had visions of everyone running a deck that just top 8'd a tourney.

Not so much. My rant may have by Westane at Mon, 08/16/2010 - 13:05
Westane's picture

Not so much. My rant may have been somewhat harsh, but hey. The "average" play level in the TP room is what I'd call "Entry Level FNM". Every once in a while you'll get a proven deck like Jund or Naya or UW Control, but it's usually something else. Unless you want to test against RDW, then just look for anyone posting for a Single Game for Standard XD

A quick question: What do you by Lord Erman at Mon, 08/16/2010 - 13:22
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5

A quick question: What do you think of Sea Gate Oracle? Did you ever test it? If no, then why not? If yes, then why did you cut it at the end? I always try to find room for that guy in almost every Blue deck I build these days (as a 2of or 3of) and I never regretted that decision this far.

And about the TP Room: First of all, I get what you say. But look at things from the other side. I for example, devoted all my "Magic-life" into building and playing Tier-1,5/Tier-2 rogue decks. Some were really good and some were plain bad. But where should I play them?

Casual Room is teaching me nothing. And I most of the time bore someone with my "super-uber expensive cutthroat" tourney(!) deck. To someone enjoying their, as you say, Tome Scours and Chandra's Spitfires, my decks are incredibly powerful. I most of the time get cursed and blocked by my opponents and so I move onto the other option... which is the TP room.

And there my decks just don't cut it. People there want to test their netdecks against other netdecks and I'm disturbing them with my rogue decks. In other words, I just waste their precious time.

So yes, where do Tier-1,5/Tier-2 rogue decks fit in? They're too powerful for the Casual Room and totally irrelevant for the TP room. I guess there isn't a clear answer to this question but now that you mentioned it in your article, I wanted to point out "the difficulties of being a rogue deck designer/player".

Waiting you reply about Sea Gate Oracle.

LE

Spot on by Scartore at Mon, 08/16/2010 - 13:29
Scartore's picture

LE is exactly right, there really isn't any good place for tier 1,5 or 2 decks to take shape online. This ties in with a lot of the complaints about the TNM events 2 weeks ago. I'm not even in that class of player and I see the discrepancy.

First the TP room. I by Westane at Mon, 08/16/2010 - 13:36
Westane's picture

First the TP room. I completely and utterly agree with you, and you're not necessarily the person I'm talking about. I agree there's no happy medium for testing new ideas, and I'm okay with that. My complaint is when you're clearly playing against "My First Deck.dec", which seems to have been happening to me all to often. I realize how bigoted I must sound, but, there it is. I blame the software more than the players, and I think a better game finder could solve the issue. I'm reminded of a few months back in a Pauper game I played in the TP room...

Him - "Hey WTF! You can't play a Dark Ritual!"
Me - "Yes I can, it's Pauper."
Him - "Yeah, STANDARD Pauper! Can't you read!?"
Me - "Yeah [inappropriate] I can read, but you didn't specify!"
Him - "[inappropriate] game comments [inappropriate]!"
Me - "[bannable offenses] you [language that offend God and puppies]!"
Him - /quit

Turns out yeah, there's a tiny little out of the way comments field for games... Who knew! It needs a LOT of work.

Now Sea Gate Oracle! I love him to little blue pieces, really. I originally did run him in my Iona control list, but I eventually cut him in favor of leaving my turn 3 open. For me the argument comes down to him or Wall of Omens, and WoO blocks Bloodbraid Elf, so for know it's the wall. When I do find the decks where I can use him, currently in UB Control which I'm testing extensively, he shines and I love him. I just didn't like his place in the curve for my UW list as it stands, but possibly post-rotation.

Oh you are one of THOSE by Paul Leicht at Mon, 08/16/2010 - 17:13
Paul Leicht's picture

Oh you are one of THOSE people. Listen when someone is nasty because you did some thing wrong, the best thing to do is just cop to it and move on. Getting nasty back serves no one. Particularly since it was your own lack of observation that started it rolling. (Who doesn't know about the comments section? They were there in 2.5.) Yeah yeah the punk was asking for a tongue lashing etc but really you are better than that. Be the semi Pro you want to be. [/end admonishment]

As far as the TP goes, it is a more finicky (Not less ironically) cas cas room. I rarely go there because if I need to test for something I ask friends for help and play closed matches.

The example was for dramatic by Westane at Mon, 08/16/2010 - 17:23
Westane's picture

The example was for dramatic effect. I got snarky, but I wasn't that bad >.<

I can be one of those people, but what are we if not for our flaws. Regardless, I stand by my opinion of the Comment section, and the UI layout, and the TP room, and fish. I don't like fish.

Grilled Salmon with Miso = to by Paul Leicht at Mon, 08/16/2010 - 17:43
Paul Leicht's picture

Grilled Salmon with Miso = to die for imho. My Dad does it great.

Lord Erman I had Oracles in by darthibanezowner at Mon, 08/16/2010 - 23:43
darthibanezowner's picture

Lord Erman

I had Oracles in my original UW list, but have since removed them as well. The three casting cost meant I never wanted to play them until at least turn 5 with counter back up.

This past weekend I took 1st at Gameday playing the Sun Titan Control deck and I played with two Courier's capsules. They were excellent the entire day. You could drop them on turn four and still have counter backup. I am rather sad that they will be leaving in October.

I don't really much to say by The American Ni... at Mon, 08/16/2010 - 17:53
The American Nightmare's picture

I don't really much to say about the article except....4.0, dude I'm still waiting for 3.0 to get fixed.

I really just wanted to say. That is the coolest PIC ever! Nice kitty.

I assume you have tested them by Sanador at Tue, 08/17/2010 - 02:21
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I assume you have tested them and decided against them, but I was wondering why you don't run any halimar depths. I assume the reason is that you don't want any more come into play tapped lands. Still, they are quite strong in a deck like this.

Correct. If I could run them by Westane at Tue, 08/17/2010 - 11:02
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Correct. If I could run them I would, as I like them very much. However I already have 8 lands that WILL come into play tapped, 4 that might, and 4 colorless lands. I think running the Depths would disrupt the mana a bit too much.

Another solid article. I by Raddman at Tue, 08/17/2010 - 13:08
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5

Another solid article. I agree with the TP thing. I have made mention to it before in some of my articles. It even bothers me more when people write articles here using test results from the TP room.

@ Paul, he was clearly being sarcastic. Stop trolling!

What really bothers me is the by speks at Tue, 08/17/2010 - 14:06
speks's picture

What really bothers me is the Mystical Tutor got banned in Legacy because of somebody from Wizards apparently did some Legacy testing in the TP room...

That was probably the same by Raddman at Tue, 08/17/2010 - 16:05
Raddman's picture

That was probably the same person I beat 2-0, 2-0 only to receive grumbles about luck sacking into triple force of will despite the fact I had used brainstorms and ponders.

Mysticals ban didn't do much to combo, but it does appear reanimator went silent.

<.< >.> Thank GOD by Westane at Tue, 08/17/2010 - 16:08
Westane's picture

<.<
>.>
Thank GOD

Agreed if that was in by Raddman at Tue, 08/17/2010 - 16:11
Raddman's picture

Agreed if that was in reference to Reanimator going silent. Next on my list of wants and desires......ban Counterbalance!

But, that's what I want to by Westane at Tue, 08/17/2010 - 16:20
Westane's picture

But, that's what I want to play eventually XD That or Landstill.

Hate that Animator is almost by menace13 at Wed, 08/18/2010 - 06:33
menace13's picture

Hate that Animator is almost useless now(outside of a few tourneys here and there), was by far and away my fav deck to play- I am a fan of spell wars and animator was such a blast-.
Now I am left wanting Vintage-Classic is dead for now and nothing outside of med4 Reanimates it-(see what i did there.
Hopefully they unban WGDragon next so Entomb sees play again

I really liked the article! by darthibanezowner at Tue, 08/17/2010 - 21:08
darthibanezowner's picture
5

I really liked the article! I never really had the problem that you seem to be having with the Tourney practice room. Occasionally I come across a deck that seems out of place, but I look at it as experience against the random deck I may face at FNM.

As for Baneslayers I think you may want to go that route. My only loss at Gameday was against Naya in the swiss. During the finals I was paired up against him again. I realized that I played too conservatively the first match. I played a more aggressive game in the finals. I ran two angels main and I also sided in the two Sphinx from the sideboard. That strategy worked out tremendously for me and I ended up taking 1st.

I have an issue of where to by Flippers_Giraffe at Wed, 08/18/2010 - 15:55
Flippers_Giraffe's picture

I have an issue of where to play my decks as well, most are too good for the casual room due to playing top/expensive cards. So I take them into the TP room where I tend to win every other game or so but I end up playing the same decks that I was playing in the casual room a lot of the time. I cant say much though as mine are rouge decks as well.

But it does leave me the with the question what should I be playing and where? I'd love to play events but dont think my skill is up to the highest level to compete and I dont want to net deck deck as I find it boring running a deck that's not mine.

I thought TNM might be the answer but knew that it wouldnt work online in the same way as playing at a local store.

So I'm left in the black void once again and havent played all week hence there will be no article from me this week.

/rant over

Is your next article going to by Drbenwayy at Fri, 08/20/2010 - 02:18
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5

Is your next article going to cover the events you've been playing in? Because I was mostly curious about the Valakut Titan matchup. I know in your article that you state Ascension and Valakut Titan are difficult to win against but with most Valakut running 4 Summoning Trap in sideboard and some even in their main, how do you even compete? The Leyline does help mitigate the Valakut damage but it just seems like a very very difficult situation to me.

You pray they don't draw by Westane at Fri, 08/20/2010 - 14:10
Westane's picture

You pray they don't draw then, or that you can counter them, or that they don't hit any creatures with them. The match is horrible, and I cover my solution to it next article :D