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By: Kumagoro42, Gianluca Aicardi
Aug 30 2013 9:17am
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 Welcome back to Tribal Apocalypse, the PRE where the man-machine interface can use more safety measures.

   Table of Contents

  1. Last Week on Tribal Apocalypse...
  2. The High Price of Winning
  3. RexDart's Show and Tell
  4. Tribal Lab: The Insect Project!
  5. Announcement Time!
  6. What's Next 

THOUGHTS OF A TRIBAL HOST

 Theros is near, and it's going to open a new age of portents! I thought (while officially naming the section where I just offer my opinion on anything tribal) that it might be nice to use this space for weekly updates on the latest news in spoiler unveiling. I mostly use MTG Salvation for this purpose, as there's a hugely popular forum with speculation threads (and hilariously apocalyptic comments), and they're always among the first to receive leaks, while thoroughly question and verify them before putting them in the current spoiler list.

 A few days ago, a new poster appeared who looked like the typical insider leaking person (which I'm convinced are mostly operating with WotC's tacit approval, at least when they're not leaking the entire set). He vaguely revealed some stuff that more or less ties with things that Mark Rosewater would hint at later (for instance, a likely black card in the block which is something that could have been in Modern Masters = possibly Thoughtseize; the dual land cycle and Future-shifted cards in Theors possibly coalescing into a Nimbus Maze cycle; a white aura, probably land-based, named "Chained to the Rocks", costing just W and acting as an exiler of sort for one creature). The one thing that seems confirmed, though, it's what MaRo referred to as "a creature with a saboteur ability (it has an effect if the creature deals combat damage to an opponent) which is one of the Power Nine". It seems that it'll be a Sphinx named "Medomai the Ageless", a flyer of undisclosed P/T that for 4WU would have "Whenever Medomai the Ageless deals combat damage to a player, take an extra turn after this one." and "Medomai the Ageless can't attack during extra turns." I use to believe the spoiler only once I see the actual card from an official source, but it really seems confirmed at the moment, which means my Sphinx deck will have to make room for her.

 We have 5 more creatures spoiled since last week, anyway, one per color:

  

 

 The Archon (yay for our 7th Archon!) unveils the bestow mechanics, which is an interesting mix of living weapon and the Licids, sort of the opposite of the former (you have it as a creature enhancer first, get a creature later), and the automatic, one-shot version of the latter. We need examples with lesser cost to properly judge it, but it seems to have potential and creates a batch of new enchantment creatures (Lucent Liminid isn't alone anymore! Except nobody would care about him now. Again.) The Timmyesque Kraken and the Elemental both showcase monstrosity some more, after Polukranos last week. So far, it seems an overcosted mechanics, but we'll see. The Demon is the first instance of devotion, which is probably the more intriguing mechanic so far, as it appears to be a more restrictive but also functionally wider take on chroma. In this case, it's used to make a Demon produce sacrificial tokens (Harpy tokens, interestingly: there will be a mechanical pairing between the two tribes?), which is a first. Of course, it's the same Demon that then wants to snack on them, so its actual advantage is questionable, but it's still free flying token generation through an ETB effect. Never a bad thing. Finally, the green Human Warrior has heroic. Not a fan of the effect, but we can see a different use of the mechanic compared to Anax and Cymede's.

 However, the most exciting development since last week is our first mythic, which is also our first God: Thassa, God of the Sea (I'm not sure if the name has been confirmed yet, because it should be "Goddess", no? Unless they go for a male neutral, which wouldn't be very flavorful though). We don't have the actual card frame yet, but the text seems confirmed: the five Gods will be mono-colored enchantment creatures that lose their creature status if a devotion threshold isn't reached (why they didn't go for the inverse, turning them into creatures when devotion hits a certain number? Because this way they're creatures in any zone, therefore able to be reanimated from the graveyard, tutorable as both creatures and enchantments, and whatnot). In particular, Thassa is a 5/5 indestructible (they will probably all have indestructible) for just 2U, but needs 5 blue mana symbols on your side of the battlefield to not regress to just an enchantment. Not that Thassa's enchantment abilities are bad at all. She has "At the beginning of your upkeep, scry 1." and "1U: Target creature you control can't be blocked this turn."

 Low-curve mythics with useful abilities that can turn into indestructible fatties? These thing will be insanely pricey, I'm afraid. The mechanic is great, anyway, and the flavor of a god needing devotion to walk the earth, while still existing as a benevolent essence otherwise, resonates wonderfully with the setting. If this is MaRo's design, it's possibly one of his best ever.


LAST WEEK ON TRIBAL APOCALYPSE...

  • Event Number: 3.33, Week 138 BE
  • Date: August 24
  • Attendance: 12
  • Rounds: 3
  • Special Rules: Duel Week: Man vs. Machine
  • Winner: Trickerie (Golem x3, Human)
  • Other undefeated: AJ_Impy (Human x3, Golem)
  • 1 Loss: romellos (Golem x2, Human), SekKuar Deathkeeper (Human x3), mihahitlor (Human x2, Construct), _Kumagoro_ (Construct x2, Human)
  • Special Prizes: none
  • Tribes: Construct (x9), Golem (x3), Human (x12)
  • Event link (with all players, pairings, standings, decks, and results): here it is
  • The Machine decklists are here.

 But enough with Ancient Greek myths, let's talk about the endless fight of men against machines, which also wonderfully resonates with me trying to force my PC to not erase all my work when I forget to save. Devious, devious machines. But the Humans win in the end! There's still hope! At least, that's what happened last week in the Man vs. Machine duel event, where players listed first in the pairings would play with a pure Human deck (aptfully purged of almost every artifact hate card in existence), while their opponents would play their choice of Construct, Golem or Myr, with the other two tribes and Artificer allowed as support. Final result: Man 10 — Machine 8.

 Interestingly, nobody chose Myr (the only true "machine", if you will), despite them being the most popular of the three in normal events. And the 3 Golem-choosing players ended at the first three places in the final ranking, so that was a great day for all the rabbis of Prague. Our first-time winner (congrats!), American player Trickerie from West Palm Beach (FL), got to use his Golem deck 3 times, including the playoff round.

 

 It's interesting that this is a Golem deck that somehow plays like aggro Humans, with lord-based interactions and pumping. Dread Statuary looks like a serious card when helped by the Splicers. And Precursor Golem is actually NOT suicidal in a Golem deck? Who would have thought? (Or is there some trick involved?). And take a mental note of that very odd Death Ward, which introduces us to a phantom sub-theme of this event: antediluvian cards.

 On the opposite end of the spectrum, finalist AJ_Impy played Human 3 times out of 4. His Golem deck was this Cabal Coffers-based one, though:

 

 Now let's have a look of the two best players' Human side. Trickerie's Human build didn't try to capitalize on the nature of his predetermined opponents, but just on his own tribe, going as far as playing rarely seen cards like Commander's Authority.

 

 AJ's very successful, land-destroying Humans were these, instead:

 

 Both Trickerie and AJ sent replays of their games and some thoughts about their deckbuilding process. You'll find them collected by the ghost of RexDart (which is me), in the deck tech's section.

 The rest of the builds were at the same time epitomes of what you would expect from such an event, and trying to playing against the very predictable meta. A few specific, nearly forgotten cards were revisited for the Human decks: Gq1rf7 used Disciple of the Vault and Moriok Rigger; pk23 had Vithian Renegades, Master Thief and, wow, Citanul Druid; romellos was playing both the Thief and Magus of the Unseen, and (because stealing is never enough) Preacherundeadgod chose Scavenger Folk, and Preacher again, but also... Tracker and Veteran Bodyguard? Was there a challenge I wasn't aware of about using extremely old cards?

   

This quickly devolved into a trip down nostalgia lane.

 Among the allowed anti-artifact warfare we saw Oxidize, Splinter, Smash to Smithereens, Echoing Ruin, Steel Sabotage, and even Tel-Jilad Justice and Viridian Revel. There was also a theme of trying to disrupt the opponent's land development, foreseeing Cloudpost bases (and we also had one Cabal Coffers deck and even one Tron by SekKuar Deathkeeper). For instance, using Avalanche Riders and Magus of the Moon, like in AJ's build.

 I went this same route with both my decks, considering that the Human base might be color-greedy. So my Human deck was Armageddon-based:

 

 While my Construct deck featured a playset of Sundering Titan (it helped that these days I'm rebuilding a Tron deck for Modern).

 

 For the most part, anyway, the Machines didn't try to directly interact with their Human adversaries too much. There have been attempts to play outside the (fuse) box, though. For one, I liked justcanceled trying not to have any artifact in play at all, and just basing his battle plan around Slag Fiend, one of the only two colored Constructs ever printed (the other is Arsenal Thresher), and the only one that's not an artifact (no idea why).

 

 The deck is cool but looks like it might use some improvement. For instance, is Soliton there just not to feel bad about discarding it? :)

 Finally, it's worth noting that undeadgod registered his very powerful Construct deck from a few weeks ago, but unfortunately, never got to use it (that's the cruelty of the Duel Weeks). And that's it.


THE HIGH PRICE OF WINNING

 Also known as: how much do the top decks cost? As of August 30, 2013, here's the answer (MTGO Traders prices; mtgGoldfish charts and analysis; the cheapest version of each card is always used; basic lands count zero):

  • 1st place, Trickerie's Golems: $4.31 (nonland cards: $2.87; tribal base: $1.12)
  • 2nd place, AJ_Impy's Humans: $29.81 (nonland cards: $29.36; tribal base: $26.76)

 Now, that's something. A 4-buck Golem deck that won an event? With all those All Is Dust and Metalworkers running around (well, not so many, but still a few) it wasn't easy to predict that the winner would turn out to be the second cheapest undefeated deck since when we keep track of it, and the cheapest event winner. Kudos to Trickerie for this wise build. And AJ_Impy's Humans, the list that brought him to the final round, wasn't that expensive either, if you consider that Human decks can easily reach high prices. Here, the only really pricey card was Magus of the Moon, who made up more than half the deck's cost. Another proof that you don't really need money to win. Well done, folks.

 The Top 10 Cheapest Decks that Went Undefeated

  1. morpphling's Goblins, $2.35, 2nd place on Event 102
  2. Trickerie's Golems: $4.31 on Event 138 (cheapest event winner)
  3. arcbounddaylabor's Goblins, $4.46, 1st place on Event 111
  4. ellmaris's Goblins, $6.52, 2nd place on Event 103
  5. mihahitlor's Goblins, $10.24, 1st place on Event 100
  6. mihahitlor's Vampires, $17.50, 1st place on Event 87
  7. AJ_Impy's Hounds, $24.26, 2nd place on Event 129
  8. brettmemphis1989's Merfolks, $25.35, 2nd place on Event 130
  9. AJ_Impy's Cats, $28.41, 2nd place on Event 129
  10. mihahitlor's Vampires, $28.72, 2nd place on Event 111

 NOTE: not adjusted to current prices; data collected since Event 85.


REXDART(?)'S SHOW AND TELL

 

 With RexDart in sabbatical for the time being, Show and Tell becomes its own entity. In fact, we still have videos and comments, only by the players themselves! Who needs a host, right?

 First, our winner Trickerie talks about his Human deck, as featured in this video where he plays against bdgp009 in Round 3.

 Trickerie: "The Human deck was pretty straightforward. Get out as many tokens/Humans as possible to pump up my Champions. Banisher Priest/Fiend Hunter were there for control, since I figured most Machine decks would be aggro-based. Mentor of the Meek dropped early could mean a ton of card draw. Bonds of Faith is basically a two-for-one in this deck: A +2/+2 for me, or a Pacifism for them. Gather the Townsfolk/Commander's Authority/Increasing Devotion — these were all late game pumps for the Champions. Massive tokens. Travel Preparations can offer some early protection and pressure.
 Overall, the idea is to get the opponent to focus on Champion of the Parish, using their removal/creatures to combat him. However, the real
card to fear in this deck was Champion of Lambholt. In the replay, you can see that both creatures became massive and dominated the game."

 And now, let's hear Trickerie talk (it's a figure of speech: just keep reading!) about his Machine deck, after seeing it in action in all the majesty of the Beta client (one positive thing I'll say about the Beta: the playing field looks better). The featured game is from Round 2 against undeadgod.

 Trickerie: "The Machine deck, on the surface, appears to be an aggro deck. However, it is really a hidden combo that none of my opponents expected, as seen in the video replay. The idea was to use Golems that were aggressive and worthy of using removal on. Chronomaton can become huge if ignored, so in a lot of match-ups, removal was used on him, which means he did his job. Battered Golem was a cheap 3/2 drop, and untapped almost whenever I wanted him to. Blade Splicer/Master Splicer — These guys offered some pump for all of my creatures. If I had to do it again, I would drop the Master Splicers for 4 Blade Splicers. I found the first strike to be much more effective. Razor Golem was a cheap drop once a few plains were played. Add the fact that he has vigilance and it's a really good card.
 Finally, the combo. You drop Precursor Golem. His ability may look dreadful at first, but it's actually ridiculously good for this deck. You drop Crumbling Colossus. A 7/4 trampler for 5. The only drawback is that he gets just 1 attack in. Well, that's all we need! Once a Precursor Golem is out, you ideally use Mighty Leap and/or Assault Strobe. This effectively gives every Golem on the field +2/+2, flying and double strike! Need protection? Play Faith's Shield or Death Ward with a Precursor Golem out.  As seen in the video, using the combo resulted in a one-turn kill."

 And now, it's AJ_Impy's turn. He sent me almost every game he played in the tournament, and you can find all of them loaded in my YouTube channel. This one is from Round 1, against mihahitlor, where the Humans' land hosers take their toll.

 And here's AJ's words on it: "My Human deck, Attacking the Foundations of Artifice, was designed as an aggro-control blend with a strong focus against nonbasic land: I was expecting lots of people to use Urzatron or Locus ramp, and even if not the lack of color requirement was a big temptation to put in lots of utility lands. So, Avalanche Riders, Magus of the Moon, Price of Progress and Pillage, which was essentially Vindicate here. Aladdin and the werewolf rounded out the artifact abuse, with Kargan Dragonlord as a finisher, with relatively few fliers expected."

 For the Machine deck, we have the battle vs. SekKuar Deathkeeper in Round 3, the only time when AJ got to use his Golems.

 AJ: "My artifact deck, Dark Golem, was something of a budget restraints kludge, having spent this week's funds on the Human deck. I basically took my Cloudpost ramp Golem deck, added in Solemn Simulacrum in place of Etched Monstrosity, and used a Coffers ramp monoblack shell, splitting the removal difference between the two with All is Dust remaining alongside Black Sun's Zenith and Chainer's Edict. This meant my manabase was mostly basic Swamps, and between Wayfarer's Bauble and the Simulacrums, I wasn't over-reliant on nonbasics in case someone else had had the same idea. The 'always kill everything' removal suite is never not a good idea, as I expected most Human decks would go the aggro route."

     Check the complete archive of Show and Tell here.


    TRIBAL LAB: THE INSECT PROJECT!

     The Insect Project is back! Or nearly so. Slug360 stepped in to fill for RexDart's absence and help building a deck that could give Insect tribe their first event win (the previous episodes of the quest can be found here). And for starters, he looked at the Insectopedia from a few weeks back, and gave his own evaluation on all those crawling critters. Next time, we'll see how he would like to put these opinions to fruition.

     Slug: From the first 13 Insects, the ones you and Rex considered the most useful (Scute Mob, Necropede, Skylasher, Broodhatch Nantuko, Blister Beetle, Acridian, Nantuko Elder, Xira Arien, Deadbridge Goliath, Bane of the Living, Vorapede, Ant Queen, Hornet Queen), I find Blister Beetle too narrow and as you said before it doesn't do anything most of the times; Acridian is just not good enough for me since spending 4 mana to cast a vanilla 2/4 it is not something I am too excited about; finally, Xira Arien is hard to cast, expensive to use, legendary and very fragile.
    From the rest of the pile of crappy Insect available these are the ones I found more appealing.

      

    Truth be told, neither I nor Rex were really sold on these three. I was pretty sure Rex would ditch Xira pretty soon upon testing

     Slug:  Army Ants: Interesting creature with some potential but you'll have to build the deck around it. Accelerating it or giving it haste could be devastating. Plated Geopede: There is an aggressive Insect deck and this is part of it, just add a few fetchlands and plan accordingly to get the most value. Bond Beetle/Ironshell Beetle: Not as bad as they seem and they could be part of a "counters matter" Insect deck. Devouring Swarm: Decent creature which could potentially end the game in one swing with stuff like Hornet Queen, not bad.

        

     Slug: Giant Solifuge: Hard to kill and good stats, puts a lot of pressure if they can't deal with it fast. Grave-Shell Scarab: As many creatures it got worse with the new rules (no damage on the stack) but it is a recurring threat and card advantage. Sadly it only dredges for 1. Mortician Beetle: I like this one a lot. It takes some work to grow it, but it can get out of hands very quickly. Nantuko Shade: Decent stats + fine ability makes it the best Shade, and the Insects can use its power. Good way to use any extra mana and with enough black mana sources it will become a real threat. Nantuko Vigilante: One of the best "disenchant" creatures and something I wouldn't mind to include in any Insect deck, as I have even ran it in non Insect builds.

        

     Slug:  Twigwalker: Interesting creature since it can make combat a nightmare for your opponent. Works great with other Insects. Gleancrawler: Very good creature with good stats and a very unique and powerful ability. It works better with some kind of sacrifice outlet. Moldgraf Monstrosity: One of the most powerful Insects with a monstrous ability, if you build your deck around it, you can provide some really sick plays.

      

     Kuma: Just to say that Gleancrawler used to be my favorite casual Natural Order target, since it automatically gives you back whatever you used to fuel the Natural Order! Fond memories. I also used to like Nantuko Vigilante, but fell out of love with it: it's clunky, you often have to pay 5 mana all at once, because otherwise they'll see it coming, and at that point it just loses the comparison with Acidic Slime. And I don't see the purpose in casting it as a 2/2 in turn 3, when you don't even know if it's needed, and you will rarely have the mana open to use it as an instant afterwards. I want my answer to be immediate, not delayed. Also, I prefer ETB effects, because they're abusable, while a morph-induced turning face up really isn't. But I absolutely want to play with Moldgraf Monstrosity!

     TO BE CONTINUED!


    ANNOUNCEMENT TIME!

     Just to remind you of a few things:

     The Tribal Achievements: welcome to the second season of the Tribal Achievements! Find new ways to have fun within Tribal Apocalypse, challenge yourself to complete all kinds of strange MTG feats, and make some tix in the process.

     The Hamtastic Award: the Biodiversity Prize dedicated to the memory of Erik Friborg has started again, for its 6th edition: be the first to run 10 different tribes in a row and you'll get 5 tix on SBena_Bot! You have to play all the rounds of an event in order for the tribe to be added to your sequence. If you repeat a previous tribe, your whole sequence resets.

     The Mongoose Pride Prize!  As the last tribe standing after everyone else had been played at least once, Mongoose has become the protagonist of a dedicated prize that will remember forever that you all neglected them despite Nimble Mongoose being featured in high-profile, tier-1 Legacy decks. The Mongoose Pride Prize will permanently award 1 tix (at SBena_Bot) to everyone who'll just... play Mongoose. That's right, you just have to play them and you'll get 1 tix, till the end of times. Well, there's just one clause: you have to win at least one match with them within the event (byes and forfeits don't count). Let's show them all what the mighty Herpestidae can do, shall we?

      
    Hard to kill, hard to play (apparently)

     The Champion Challenge: challenge one of our Tribal Champions, and win an Egg of Tarmogoyf (aka a Future Sight booster, courtesy of SBena_Bot) and 20 points in the seasonal leaderboard! In order to do that, you must: 1) choose one of the Challenge Decks; 2) end X-1 or better with it in a Tribal Apocalypse event; 3) beat its creator in a challenge! Follow this link for the complete ruling and the decklists.

     The Top Players Lockout: every time a Top Player (either a Google Era Top 8, an Ultimate Champion or a seasonal Top 8) will end undefeated, they will not be allowed to register the same tribe and deck again for 4 events (i.e. they'll have to register a different deck or decks 4 times before coming back to the undefeated one). With "deck" is meant a specific, recognizable archetype (e.g. Wall-Drazi), which in some case will be linked to a specific combo card (e.g. Helm of Obedience). A list of the current lockouts is maintained here.

     Videos: Send us replays of your games and we'll feature them in these articles! Don't know how? Read this quick guide in 6 easy steps and start saving your tribal feats for posterity!


     WHAT'S NEXT

     The upcoming Tribal Apocalypse events of the Blippian Era (every Saturday at 17:00 GMT):

    • 3.34 (Week 139 BE), on August 31: Pure Tribal (no off-tribe creatures, no Big Shot Tribes nor T9 cards allowed)
    • 3.35 (Week 140 BE), on September 7: Tribal Underdog (only Underdog Tribes allowed)
    • 3.36 (Week 141 BE), on September 14: Regular Tribal (just plain old Legacy Tribal Wars)
    • 3.37 (Week 142 BE), on September 21: Tribal Singleton (only 1 copy of each nonbasic land)

    Check out the full Tribal Calendar for 2013!

    Take the Quick Survey about the ban list and the event rotation!

     See you all in the Tribal room!

 

17 Comments

Surprised at no Myr players. by RexDart at Fri, 08/30/2013 - 15:18
RexDart's picture

Surprised at no Myr players. I had drawn up a Myr deck with Gobln Welder and Battlesphere I was gonna run if I'd been able to play, though we made a late decision to go camping last weekend instead.

Excited about Theros, though I'm thinking it looks very Timmy/EDH so far. I like that sometimes, but we don't need another Titan-era "battlecruiser" Magic.

we don't need another by Kumagoro42 at Sat, 08/31/2013 - 04:36
Kumagoro42's picture

we don't need another Titan-era "battlecruiser" Magic.

Yes, we do! :)
But the Gods look more Spike-ish to me.

Speaking of battlecruiser Magic, I was thinking the other day that the Eldrazi will (and should) never be surpassed as the biggest, scariest creatures in the game. They've been defined as the equivalent of Lovecraft's Outer Gods, from the infinity beyond the planes. What could they possibly come up with to beat that? Even by returning to Zendikar, and introducing new Eldrazi, Emrakul will always have to be the #1 of the gang.

"There is always a greater by AJ_Impy at Sat, 08/31/2013 - 09:48
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"There is always a greater power."

The Eldrazi lost. Twice.

Not against creatures. by Kumagoro42 at Sat, 08/31/2013 - 15:09
Kumagoro42's picture

Not against creatures.

If it's sentient, it's a by AJ_Impy at Sat, 08/31/2013 - 15:12
AJ_Impy's picture

If it's sentient, it's a creature. Heck, Gideon beat them, and he explicitly does the creature thing as his schtick.

You know what I was talking by Kumagoro42 at Sat, 08/31/2013 - 15:18
Kumagoro42's picture

You know what I was talking about. Creature type, aka that thing Tribal decks are built around.

Also, I didn't mention "winning in a fight". I mentioned "being the biggest". Royal Assassin kills most things (including Emrakul) and it's a 1/1.

Nothing is bigger than by AJ_Impy at Sat, 08/31/2013 - 16:12
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Nothing is bigger than leviathans. Nothing is bigger than Dreadnoughts. Nothing is bigger than beasts. Heck, Worldbreaker Wurm matches Emrakul for size, and Draco beats her for cost. There is no such thing as a permanent record that will never be broken.

I said "biggest and by Kumagoro42 at Sat, 08/31/2013 - 16:25
Kumagoro42's picture

I said "biggest and scariest". None of those are scarier than Emrakul. Because none of those are both a 30 body + protection from almost everything + evasion + (most importantly) what essentially boils down to "destroy the opponent's battlefield". Or if you want, "when this creature attacks, roll a die. On a roll of 1-5, you win the game. You can re-roll".
It's the reason why Emrakul is the finisher of choice for ramp decks.

Plus, the flavor. I was mostly talking about flavor, and the way flavor influences the mechanics, with the new gods in mind. The new gods will be strong, possibly way more useful and versatile and played than Eldrazi. But it's Apollo vs. Azathoth.

They consciously (and I'd say purposely) painted themselves into a corner when they let Azathoth into their setting. It's possible to conceive something superior, but it's too risky both flavor-wise and mechanics-wise. So my prediction is that Emrakul will never be beaten as Tron finisher of choice. There's no design space there and they don't want to go there to begin with.

As much as I get what you are by Paul Leicht at Sat, 08/31/2013 - 22:34
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As much as I get what you are saying I think AJ has the right of it here. Scary? that's subjective and bigger? Well there is ALWAYS something bigger. We just haven't necessarily discovered it yet.

When we do it will be "Eldra what? Emrawho?"

On the other hand I agree with your sentiment that nothing SHOULD be bigger than (or as big as) Emrakul and co.

Also more like Apollo vs Cthulhu. Or maybe Yggdrysal.

I wrote an article about it: by Kumagoro42 at Sun, 09/01/2013 - 08:01
Kumagoro42's picture

I wrote an article about it: the biggest creature in the game has infinite body. (And Chameleon Colossus, or others with the same mechanic, is the one that reaches the infinity of greatest magnitude.) In comparison, Emrakul's body is approximable to zero.

The point is what they'll allow for a card to have written on it, in order to convey godlike status. I think the Theros Gods will have great flavor without bombastically take the Emrakul++ route. They could totally write a story where the Eldrazi attack Theros and the Theros Gods successfully repel them.

It's indeed interesting to contemplate the different ways they used to convey godlike status over time (not including planeswalkers, whose modern form is more akin to superheroes/supervillains, which sometimes have godlike flavor, but in a different way).

Eldrazi are essentially all about individuality, and what they do is devouring worlds (Lovecraft aside, Emrakul's strongest inspiration is probably Galactus).

On the other hand, the Theros Gods (for what we have seen so far) need the support of their people and are more about boosting their followers than they are about getting their own hands dirty.

The Kamigawa Myojins (I wonder if they will retcon their type adding "God" at this point, I hope so) were about channeling a very powerful effect from their color.

We also have godlike effect like Phage's, whose destructive power is depicted as able to annihilate anything by touch, which is something even Emrakul can't do.

I might write an article about this aspect of the game, after Theros is released.

Yeah I almost said Apollo vs by Paul Leicht at Sun, 09/01/2013 - 13:06
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Yeah I almost said Apollo vs Galactus lol. But then the temptation would be to make it totally Marvel and say Captain Marvel vs Galactus or Squirrel Girl vs Galactus (she totally kicks his ass as I understand the lore.)

Completely agree on by AJ_Impy at Sun, 09/01/2013 - 13:13
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Completely agree on retroactively bestowing Godhood. Other candidates include Karona, False God, and somewhat ironically Emrakul aka the god Emeria, Ulamog aka the god Ula and Kozilek, aka the god Kosi.

Yeah, going with the rules by Kumagoro42 at Sun, 09/01/2013 - 14:43
Kumagoro42's picture

Yeah, going with the rules used by Mark Gottlieb during the Grand Creature Type Update, Karona should surely be granted the God type in virtue of being said in her card's name (that's how we got things like Soldier Warrior). (Then again, it also says it's "false", so I'm not entirely sure here).

Also the Spirit Avatars from Shadowmoor/Eventide. They're Deus, Deity, Godhead, and so. One is a Demigod, but a demigod is still partly God, just like a creature that's, say, half Merfolk and half Elf got both the types.

If they take this route, the God tribe is shaping up to be really interesting.

Good point on the spirit by AJ_Impy at Sun, 09/01/2013 - 15:34
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Good point on the spirit avatars. That said, there's a lot of avatar overlap here, that tribe being the usual catchall for deific personification to date, see also Marit Lage and Progenitus.

Yeah, I kinda think they by Kumagoro42 at Sun, 09/01/2013 - 15:45
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Yeah, I kinda think they could've gone with Avatar for these gods — after all, it's how the gods walk the earth anyway: through avatars. (Even the Eldrazi we see are the Eldrazi forced into material form by the still unnamed lithomancer that was buddy with Sorin and Ugin.)

They wanted to associate the new subtype with the new card mechanic, I guess. To better focus on their flavor and peculiarity.

Demigod generally doesn't by Paul Leicht at Mon, 09/02/2013 - 02:12
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Demigod generally doesn't mean half god but one of small importance. Should translate therefore as "small god"

In mythology, a demigod is by Kumagoro42 at Mon, 09/02/2013 - 05:16
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In mythology, a demigod is often the offspring of a god and a mortal (like Achilles or Perseus and all the other kids Zeus disseminated throughout the world). But you're right that they might have thought of the other definition instead, because otherwise it doesn't seem too fair that Rakdos gets a half god while the other pairings get a full one.

(It's still not fair that Rakdos gets a lesser god, but I guess they just ran out of synonyms.)