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By: one million words, Pete Jahn
Sep 25 2015 12:00pm
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State of the Program for September 25th 2015

In the News:

Prize Splitting Policy Update: Wizards has updated the Code of Conduct on prize splits. This change brings prize splitting online into line with the rules for prize splits in paper Magic.   Here’s the new language. 

 

“In the final round of an event, two players matched against each other may negotiate their match result to split whatever prizes are at stake between them, including (but not limited to) Qualifier Points and invitations. If an event cuts to a Top 8 playoff, the final round is defined as the last round of that playoff. Offering prizes outside those Magic Online would award based on the outcome of that match to the participants is still considered bribery, as is offering a prize split prior to the final round of an event. 

 

All prize splits are done at the players' own risk, and Magic Online will not enforce any agreed-upon splits in any situation." 

 

I’ll talk about this at more length below. The TL:DR is that you can split in the FINAL MATCH of a SINGLE ELIMINATION event or Top 8. Splits anywhere else, including in the final round of Swiss (e.g. round four of a Daily), are still illegal.  

 

No PTQs this Weekend: It’s paper prerelease weekend. Go support your local game store and Battle for Zendikar. 

 

Community Wins the Cup: The Community Cup (details here) was last weekend.  The Community Team won. Well done Community team! The event recap is here. Thanks to the Community Team’s awesomeness, everyone who logged in on MTGO last weekend will get two sets – one foil and one non-foil – of the Unhinged full art lands plus an alt art Thalia. The swag will be distributed during next week’s downtime. 

 

Wizards of the Coast Forums to be Shut Down: Wizards will be retiring their in-house discussion forums at the end of next month. The article announcing the shutdown is here. I talk about the change in the opinion section. 

 

Streamer Showdown Today: Wizards will run two special Streamer drafts on Friday, Sept. 25th, featuring Legacy Cube.   All 16 participants will be streaming their drafts and rounds. The first draft will kick off at 1pm PDT, and the second at 6pm PDT.  

 

FNM Foils Announced: Wizards has announced the FNM foils for the next couple months. These foils are awarded at paper FNM events, but they also frequently appear as store or event promos. The next three are Ultimate Price, Roast and Anticipate.   Ultimate Price has already been announced as next month’s Store Promo.

 

 

Pairing Algorithm Updated: Wizards has made some tweaks and improvements to the algorithm used to pair players in Swiss rounds of large events.   The changes will reduce the number of players who get paired down (paired against someone with a worse record). It also changes how those pair downs are done – previously the player with the best record in the higher results group is paired against the lowest ranked player in the lower group – now the lowest ranked member in the higher group will be paired against the highest ranked player in the lower group. While pair-downs still negatively affect tie-breakers, the changes should reduce that impact. 

 

HEX lawsuit Settled: A year or so ago, Cryptozoic released an online game that played and felt a lot like Magic. Wizards sued, and that suit has now been settled. Wizards won, but is allowing Cryptozoic to license the intellectual property rights at issue, so Hex will be back. 

 

The Timeline:

This is a list of things we have been promised, or just want to see coming back.   Another good source for dates and times is the MTGO calendar and the weekly blog, while the best source for known bugs is the Known Issues List. For quick reference, here are some major upcoming events.   In addition, there are either one or two online PTQs each weekend. 

 

Item: date and notes
  • MOCS Season 10: runs from August 26th through September 30th. Promo is an alt art Stifle.
  • MOCS Season 11: runs from September 30th through October 28th. Promo is an old bordered Sword of Feast and Famine.
  • Legacy Cube: September 23rd through October 9th. Details here.
  • Standard League Close and End: The last chance to enter is Oct. 5th. The league ends Oct. 7th.   After that, we will get a new league with the new Standard format.
  • Battle for Zendikar Prerelease: starts Oct. 9th.
  • From the Vault: Angels: October 12, 2015. Details here.
  • Legendary Cube: Nov. 18th. Details here.
  • Oath of the Gatewatch Prerelease: January 29–February 1, 2016
  • Implementation of the ‘Tuck” Rule in Commander: Delayed – no date given.

 

Opinion Section: Splitting

This week, Wizards has revised the Code of Conduct to allow splitting in exactly one circumstance: in the final match of a single elimination event.   This means that players are allowed to negotiate a split in the finals of a single elimination 8 man, or in the final round of the Top 8 of a PE, PTQ, or MOCs.   You cannot negotiate a split in the Swiss round of one of those events, nor in a Swiss draft, nor in a DE. This mirrors the way the paper world works, at least for competitive events. And in competitive events, the rules are pretty strict – you have to play Magic to determine the outcome of a match, not make deals. 

 

Why is this? Because the outcome of any given match affects the tie-breakers of everyone either player played against.  The first tie-breaker after matches won is “Opponent Match Wins.” This tie-breaker depends on how the player’s opponents did in the event.  

 

How could this matter?   Let’s assume that you and I are in a 7 round PE. We are both finish 5-2, and one of use will make it into the Top 8 on tiebreakers. The other will finish ninth. It will come down to whether that guy you played in round 3 wins or loses. If he wins, you are in. If he does not – if he negotiates a split and concedes – you are out. Would you be happy with that?

 

This does happen.   Opponent Match Wins is the most important tie-breaker, and draws between players in the Swiss can and do affect who makes Top 8. This is why deals, bribery and any other method of deciding the result of a match other than playing Magic are not allowed in Swiss rounds. Splits and deals are allowed in the finals, because in the finals the only players whose tie-breakers could be affected by the deal are the two players left in the event – the two players involved in the deal. 

 

It is true that splits have less or no effect in events where payout is based solely on match wins, with no cut. However, Wizards wants one bright line that applies in all cases, and that line is “no deals except in the finals of a single elimination event.”  

 

Note that the prohibition only applies to bribery and deals that affect the outcome of the match. The prohibition is there to stop the concessions driven by “if you let me win, you/we get more packs.” That’s illegal. However, if you are going to play out the match normally, but arrange a split to soften the loss – e.g. “winner gives the loser a pack” – that’s fine. It’s what we judges call making friends / being friendly, and we judges totally approve of that. 

 

Is this a bit confusing? Yes, it is. Conceptually, if the outcome of the match is going to be affected by prizes or promises, the split is probably illegal. If the outcome of the match will depend on playing Magic, and the split just makes the prize award more even, that’s probably fine. However, if you want to do anything like this in the paper world, call a judge and check with them. It’s safer, and they are trained in making that determination. (It is also a topic that deserves more than the limited discussion I am giving it here. So if you are interested in more, ask a judge.) 

 

Bringing this back to Magic online, what does this mean?   First off, it means that in the finals of a 4-3-2-2, you can say “I just want the QP. Concede and I’ll give you my 4 packs.” It also means it is fine to split an 8-4 six and six. However, it probably does not mean Wizards will bring back the ID/split button.   That only works if the prizes can be split evenly, and that does not always happen. You cannot split a 4-3-2-2 evenly, and QPs mean even 8-4s don’t split cleanly.  

 

Opinion Section: Forums

Wizards has announced that it is finally closing down the official Wizards forums, including both the D&D and Magic forums. It is the final death knell of what was once an amazing online community. Fifteen years ago, the forums had thousands of users and it hosted active and vibrant groups and networks. Once upon a time the rules forum was the best place to get rulings, but the community was much broader. It hosted stories, online games and RPG campaigns and endless discussions. It was also immensely friendly and very welcoming to new members and new players.  

 

Over time, two things combined to kill the forums and the community that lived there: trolls and Wizards attempts to update their software. That’s all it took.  

 

Trolls are the stupid, selfish, socially and morally retarded jackasses that do almost nothing but bully, abuse and belittle others. They criticize endlessly, and contribute very little to nothing. Worst of all, they make participating in a forum or community unpleasant for everyone else. For many people, they can make it unpleasant enough to drive them away.  

 

Way back in the golden era, the community basically policed itself, using volunteer moderators. Over time, the trolls got worse and Wizard’s legal and PR liability grew. Eventually, Wizards had to bring the moderator functions in house, and tighten the rules. This did not go over well, and over time the trolls, the strictness of the moderators and the resistance all grew. (This is the simplified version, without the full history of Wizzos, VCLs, etc.) 

 

Over time, Wizards has also tried to “update” and “evolve” their forums software. At one point, Wizards tried to convert the forums community and web pages into “Facebook for gamers.” This was the infamous Gleemax community, and it failed, badly. Later on, Wizards tried another change to incorporate a Wiki, groups, blogs, etc. into the community, but all this really did was make the forums harder to use. A third botched redesign a couple years back pretty much killed the forums, and the final nail was the Wizards Account Manager debacle last year.  

 

Wizards will shut down the forums at the end of October. They recommend copying anything you need before then. I do to, but you will have to fight with the terrible search software to find anything.  

 

The forums community, at its height, was amazing. A lot of good people lived there, and a lot of people I will remember fondly. A special shout-out to Algona, whose stats and analysis I frequently pirated. Also Bubba0077 and Hamtastic, who did more for the forums that almost anyone I can think of.   And Cauchy, who tried to revive a failed mess in its last year or so despite having to deal with a lot of people who had been badly burned over the years, and were basically discouraged and cynical. That describes me, and most of the rest of us still there – Algona, AJ, Telir, etc. But not ProtossX – it was just a bot programmed to bash Wizards and troll everyone and everything.  

 

I started listing forum dwellers I remembered reading, talking with or arguing with. Here’s a partial list.  

 

Algona, AJ_Impy, Hamtastic, RoaringPossum, Cauchy, Bubba0077, pcjr, joekewwl, Gathion, skullonastick, Nushea, Sax, Natedaw, endless_nameless, Tempesteye, Ivo, MTGKaoioshin, fatguy_poolshark, Ith, Telir, BlippyTheSlug, dangerlinto, DonTheMage, Elf, DwarvenPony, zombiegleemax, CalveraX, Lawnmower_Elf, longtimegone, Emoticon, programmerman,  Zlehtnoba, WiseGreen, Enigma256, PanteraCanes, xger, Michelle_Wong, JMason, Wilmheath,  Silentbobus, cretonic1, PhoenixLau, no_peace, shardfenix, SirGog, Sivdaddy, Vaarsuvius1, Plejades, BatDwarf, miss_bun, meuslix, GainsBanding, PirateAmmo, bactgudz, Anchorman, Homer’s_Duff, Kumagoro, Matt_Holck, Xtofyr, timotheos,  WBurgess,  Teish-Szat,     

 

And, occasionally, WotC_K and even WotC_Worth.  

 

I apologize to everyone I missed – I’m not all that good with remembering names. 

 

Here’s an example of what we are losing. I have copied that, and am working to copy all the links.  

 

Cutting Edge Tech:

Standard: We are one week away from a new Standard. In the meantime, SCG ran the last Open with Theros block cards. The Top 8 decks are here. The winner, and third place, decks were flaming balls of, er, red cards. Meanwhile, in Texas Neal Oliver was winning the third and final US WMCQ with a 5 color dragons deck. His article on the win is here. On MTGO, you have a couple weeks to try them out in the Standard League.

 

Really, Truly Mono-Red
Jasper Johnson-Epstein, Third Place, SCG Standard Open Milwaukee
Creatures
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Abbot of Keral Keep
1 Chandra, Fire of Kaladesh
2 Lightning Berserker
3 Zurgo Bellstriker
1 Goblin Heelcutter
8 cards

Other Spells
4 Exquisite Firecraft
4 Wild Slash
4 Stoke the Flames
4 Searing Blood
4 Lightning Strike
22 cards
Lands
21 Mountain
21 cards

Eidolon of the Great Revel

 

 

Modern:  The Top 8 of the SCG Modern Premier IQ was also full of burn decks, but the deck that won it all featured a lot of lifegain and quick walls, coupled with control elements and Sun Titans.   And Pilgrim’s Eyes!

 

 

Legacy: SCG ran a Legacy Premier IQ in Milwaukee as well. The Top 8 is here

 

 

 

Card Prices

Note: all my prices come from the fine folks at MTGOTraders.com. These are retail prices, and generally the price of the lowest priced, actively traded version. (Prices for some rare promo versions are not updated when not in stock, so I skip those.)   You can get these cards at MTGOTraders.com web store, or from their bots: MTGOTradersBot(#) (they have bots 1-10), CardCaddy and CardWareHouse, or sell cards to MTGOTradersBuyBot(#) (they have buybots 1-4). I have bought cards from MTGOTraders for over a decade now, and have never been overcharged or disappointed. 

 

Standard staples: Standard prices are wobbly, with people selling off, or grabbing a few cards for that last couple weeks of League. Theros block cards are beginning to tank hard. Take a look at Elspeth. She was $20-$30 a few months ago.  

 

Standard & Block Cards
Price
Last Week
Change
% Change
(Anafenza, the Foremost)
$11.37
$10.73
$0.64
6%
(Collected Company)
$9.07
$9.30
($0.23)
-2%
(Deathmist Raptor)
$16.80
$17.81
($1.01)
-6%
(Den Protector)
$9.12
n/a
n/a
n/a
(Dragonlord Atarka)
$7.94
$7.79
$0.15
2%
(Dragonlord Ojutai)
$24.87
$23.03
$1.84
8%
(Dromoka's Command)
$0.38
$6.53
($6.15)
-94%
(Eidolon of the Great Revel)
$19.07
$16.70
$2.37
14%
(Elspeth, Sun's Champion)
$2.93
$4.75
($1.82)
-38%
(Flooded Strand)
$7.97
n/a
n/a
n/a
(Hangarback Walker)
$9.64
$10.29
($0.65)
-6%
(Jace, Vryn's Prodigy)
$33.70
$35.45
($1.75)
-5%
(Keranos, God of Storms)
$18.86
$18.28
$0.58
3%
(Liliana, Heretical Healer)
$6.56
$6.36
$0.20
3%
(Monastery Mentor)
$9.91
$10.00
($0.09)
-1%
(Nissa, Vastwood Seer)
$13.27
$13.17
$0.10
1%
(Sorin, Solemn Visitor)
$9.98
$9.52
$0.46
5%
(Soulfire Grand Master)
$7.95
n/a
n/a
n/a
$6.13
$6.72
($0.59)
-9%
(Ugin, the Spirit Dragon)
$8.93
$9.23
($0.30)
-3%

 

Modern staples:  Modern prices were mixed. No real trends – but I’m hoping we see a Modern League sometime soon. That might help Modern prices a bit. 

 

Modern Cards
Price
Last Week
Change
% Change
(Auriok Champion)
$32.00
$31.46
$0.54
2%
$21.07
$21.24
($0.17)
-1%
(Blood Moon)
$24.17
$23.54
$0.63
3%
(Cavern of Souls)
$28.33
$29.54
($1.21)
-4%
(Ensnaring Bridge)
$27.41
$27.00
$0.41
2%
(Fulminator Mage)
$10.98
$13.94
($2.96)
-21%
(Geist of Saint Traft)
$18.65
$18.33
$0.32
2%
$44.46
$40.22
$4.24
11%
(Grove of the Burnwillows)
$30.98
$26.47
$4.51
17%
(Horizon Canopy)
$29.59
$29.28
$0.31
1%
(Inkmoth Nexus)
$24.65
$27.10
($2.45)
-9%
(Liliana of the Veil)
$97.41
$108.30
($10.89)
-10%
(Mox Opal)
$39.88
$30.46
$9.42
31%
(Oblivion Stone)
$19.16
$17.82
$1.34
8%
$19.40
$22.54
($3.14)
-14%
(Scalding Tarn)
$39.49
$37.46
$2.03
5%
$23.26
$21.74
$1.52
7%
(Snapcaster Mage)
$19.74
$18.19
$1.55
9%
$46.81
$45.98
$0.83
2%
(Twilight Mire)
$28.10
$27.99
$0.11
0%
(Vendilion Clique)
$18.12
$17.86
$0.26
1%
(Voice of Resurgence)
$30.52
$25.56
$4.96
19%

 

Legacy and Vintage: Eternal format cards are about even overall, although Legacy cards are, in general, up, and Vintage cards down.  

 

Legacy / Vintage Cards
Price
Last Week
Change
% Change
(Ancestral Recall)
$37.31
$41.60
($4.29)
-10%
(Black Lotus)
$104.73
$106.34
($1.61)
-2%
(Containment Priest)
$27.89
$28.44
($0.55)
-2%
$23.16
$23.23
($0.07)
0%
$45.97
$45.82
$0.15
0%
(Food Chain)
$28.71
$28.60
$0.11
0%
(Force of Will)
$22.49
$23.27
($0.78)
-3%
$24.79
$25.21
($0.42)
-2%
(Infernal Tutor)
$23.76
$27.25
($3.49)
-13%
(Lord of Atlantis)
$24.13
$22.14
$1.99
9%
$120.24
$120.24
$0.00
0%
(Mox Jet)
$25.73
$27.95
($2.22)
-8%
(Mox Sapphire)
$44.45
$45.75
($1.30)
-3%
(Rishadan Port)
$171.26
$166.76
$4.50
3%
(Show and Tell)
$68.11
$68.82
($0.71)
-1%
(The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale)
$21.94
$22.46
($0.52)
-2%
(Time Walk)
$21.34
$26.62
($5.28)
-20%
(Toxic Deluge)
$22.80
$23.61
($0.81)
-3%
(True-Name Nemesis)
$22.25
$21.98
$0.27
1%
$21.58
$21.58
$0.00
0%
$64.94
$63.76
$1.18
2%

 

Set Redemption: You can redeem complete sets on MTGO. You need to purchase a redemption voucher from the store for $25. During the next downtime, Wizards removes a complete set from your account and sends you the same set in paper.   For those of you who redeem, here are the retail prices of one of everything set currently available in the store, excluding sets that are not currently draftable or not redeemable.  Note – I expect to cut Theros block sets a week or two after they disappear from the draft list. 

 

Complete Set
Price
Last Week
Change
% Change
Battle for Zendikar
coming
n/a
n/a
n/a
Born of the Gods
$19.00
$21.62
($2.62)
-12%
Dragons of Tarkir
$140.54
$142.50
($1.96)
-1%
Fate Reforged
$54.58
$57.10
($2.52)
-4%
Journey into Nyx
$55.63
$61.26
($5.63)
-9%
Khans of Tarkir
$100.03
$96.30
$3.73
4%
M15
$58.80
$64.16
($5.36)
-8%
Magic Origins
$105.19
$109.34
($4.15)
-4%
Theros
$38.66
$39.99
($1.33)
-3%

 

The Good Stuff:

The following is a list of all the non-promo, non-foil cards on MTGO that retail for more than $25 per card.  These are the big ticket items in the world of MTGO.  The list grew a bit this week, and is now at thirty-three cards. On the plus side, other than some Mercadian Masques cards and maybe Liliana and Wasteland, MTGO is reasonably affordable in every format.   

 

Name
Set
Rarity
Price
Rishadan Port
 MM
Rare
171.26
Misdirection
 MM
Rare
120.24
Black Lotus
 VMA
Bonus
104.73
Liliana of the Veil
 ISD
Mythic Rare
97.41
Wasteland
 TPR
Rare
68.76
Show and Tell
 UZ
Rare
68.11
Wasteland
 TE
Uncommon
64.94
Tangle Wire
 NE
Rare
62.5
Tarmogoyf
 MMA
Mythic Rare
54.21
Tarmogoyf
 MM2
Mythic Rare
49.34
Tarmogoyf
 FUT
Rare
46.81
Doomsday
 WL
Rare
45.97
Griselbrand
 AVR
Mythic Rare
44.46
Mox Sapphire
 VMA
Bonus
44.45
Scalding Tarn
 ZEN
Rare
39.49
Ancestral Recall
 VMA
Bonus
37.31
Jace, Vryn's Prodigy
 ORI
Mythic Rare
33.7
Force of Will
 MED
Rare
33.16
Auriok Champion
 5DN
Rare
32
Mox Opal
 SOM
Mythic Rare
31.5
Grove of the Burnwillows
 FUT
Rare
30.98
Voice of Resurgence
 DGM
Mythic Rare
30.52
Mox Opal
 MM2
Mythic Rare
29.88
Ensnaring Bridge
 ST
Rare
29.6
Horizon Canopy
 FUT
Rare
29.59
Food Chain
 MM
Rare
28.71
Ensnaring Bridge
 8ED
Rare
28.5
Cavern of Souls
 AVR
Rare
28.33
Twilight Mire
 EVE
Rare
28.1
Containment Priest
 C14
Rare
27.89
Ensnaring Bridge
 7E
Rare
27.41
Lord of Atlantis
 TSB
Rare
26.4
Mox Ruby
 VMA
Bonus
26.12
Mox Jet
 VMA
Bonus
25.73
Blood Moon
 MMA
Rare
25.09

 

The big number is the retail price of a playset (4 copies) of every card available on MTGO. Assuming you bought the least expensive versions available, the cost of owning a playset of every card on MTGO you can own is $ 24,140.  That’s down about $50 from last week. Statistically, that’s nothing.  

 

Weekly Highlights:

This week I got around to trying Rally Elves and GR Devotion in Leagues. Results were mixed. GR Devotion did some insane things at times, but I really missed card drawing at times. Nothing is quite as bad as drawing more ramp when you already have a bazillion mana.   As for Rally Elves, people are ready for it now. My first match was a mirror, and my opponent had sideboard answers. Anafenza the Foremost is really good against a Satyr Wayfinder deck.   

 

Next time around I’ll be playing a blue-based control deck. I want Dig and Jace’s Ingenuity and lots more card drawing. 

 

PRJ 

 

“One Million Words” and “3MWords” on MTGO 

 

This series is an ongoing tribute to Erik “Hamtastic” Friborg. 

 

HammyBot Super Sale: HammyBot was set up to sell off Erik Friborg’s collection, with all proceeds going to his wife and son. So far, HammyBot has raised over $8,100, but there are a lot of cards left in the collection. Those cards are being sold at  MTGOTrader’s Buy Price.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

25 Comments

Elspeth by Sensei at Fri, 09/25/2015 - 12:16
Sensei's picture

Sun's Champion was never, ever, at any point, above 25 tickets.

Hex Lawsuit. "Wizards won"? by Claw at Fri, 09/25/2015 - 12:34
Claw's picture

Hex Lawsuit. "Wizards won"? What kind of nonsense is that. The suit was settled on an undisclosed terms, satisfactory to the both parties.

Hex claimed that they were by longtimegone at Fri, 09/25/2015 - 20:41
longtimegone's picture

Hex claimed that they were not using any wizards owned intellectual property.

Given that this settlement information mentions that they will now be licensing the IP they claimed not be using from Wizards, it's hard to interpret it as anything other than Hex losing that fight.

It could also be the case by TheKidsArentAlright at Fri, 09/25/2015 - 23:37
TheKidsArentAlright's picture

It could also be the case that Hex realized there was no way they could fight a legal battle against Hasbro's checkbook and simply acquiesced rather than go bankrupt.

That would STILL count as a by Paul Leicht at Sat, 09/26/2015 - 04:27
Paul Leicht's picture

That would STILL count as a win for Hasbro/WotC...

I suppose it does as far as by TheKidsArentAlright at Sat, 09/26/2015 - 05:00
TheKidsArentAlright's picture

I suppose it does as far as they're concerned, but the nature of the settlement is shady at best. It certainly doesn't make me want to support Hasbro/WotC/MODO as a consumer.

Why exactly? HEX was by Dawwy at Sat, 09/26/2015 - 15:53
Dawwy's picture

Why exactly? HEX was blatantly using Magic-esque game mechanics. You can create a card game which is a succesful one and much much more far away from MtG (Hearthstone for example) - they were just piggybacking.

Considering that the terms of by Claw at Sat, 09/26/2015 - 04:57
Claw's picture

Considering that the terms of licensing agreement are undisclosed, claiming that this is a "win" for wizards is nothing more than blabbering and speculation.

Most out of court settlements by Felorin at Sat, 09/26/2015 - 09:37
Felorin's picture

Most out of court settlements are much more satisfactory to one party than to the other. Though I suppose there's occasional exceptions.

It does seem pretty unlikely that the makers of Hex would be the side that got a "good deal" on the undisclosed terms. If they weren't paying a fairly significant licensing fee, Hasbro wouldn't have much incentive to agree to the deal.

Thanks by Cauchy at Fri, 09/25/2015 - 14:47
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5

Thanks for the honorable mention. I am sad that I arrived at the forums after most people had already left. I had hoped that the forums would experience a resurrection. Now I only hope that the forums will emerge somewhere else. I think they were very enjoyable.

I think Pete give the trolls by xger at Fri, 09/25/2015 - 16:36
xger's picture

I think Pete give the trolls too much credit. I never went back to the forums because everytime I tried WotC had found a new way to make them terrible. I don't get why WotC is insistent on doing tech things themselves when they are clearly, woefully, inadequate at it. Even the website continues to get worse.

I appreciated being reminded of the various posters I discussed/argued with. I enjoyed it mostly, except sometimes with ProtossX it was torture.

Trolls by Adam_the_Mentat at Fri, 09/25/2015 - 16:16
Adam_the_Mentat's picture

Yes Trolls had a hand in making the forums less fun, but do we expect any better from Twitter, Reddit and Tumblr? They have more trolls than the WOTC forums could ever hope to have. You had to actively sign up for the forums for D&D and MTG, but now any ol' idiot signed up for these third party sites could crap all over a player's post. It's just another instance of WOTC saying "we can't do this by ourselves, it's too hard, let's let someone else do it."

Also, how ridiculous is it that Lord of Atlantis is worth more than two moxes?

Lord of Atlantis by Ikoma_Aze at Sat, 09/26/2015 - 18:41
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Any chance of adding Lord of Atlantis to the Modern cards that are tracked week to week?

Thanks for the awesome article series as usual!

over in Legacy by one million words at Mon, 09/28/2015 - 10:09
one million words's picture

Lord of Atlantis is hiding in the Legacy section. I may move him to Modern. He sees play on both formats, and even Vintage, though.

Pete, well said. I did a good by Paul Leicht at Fri, 09/25/2015 - 16:29
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5

Pete, well said. I did a good portion of my latest article on the forums closing because it upset me so much. I'd like to think that we (I post as Telir there) did a pretty good job of containing the trolls and making it a safe place to post so I don't think it was the trolls who ruined the forums. It was totally a WOTC internal chaos based decision and I can't help think Adam is on to something with the "we are helpless" posture of those worthies. I don't think they actually are helpless but I think they pose really well.

I read through that list of by AJ_Impy at Fri, 09/25/2015 - 17:41
AJ_Impy's picture
5

I read through that list of old Forumites and Beebers and it was heartwrenching. So many great people with whom we have lost contact or worse. Don't forget Lee, he was one of us long before he got his dream job at Wizards, and still was with us on the forums until about the third or fourth catastrophic revamp.

The community died long before this pending shutdown. It is a sad acknowledgement of failure, of all the incompetent attempts to artificially recreate what they once had so freely. If UnCon means anything to you, if you can remember CharOp or the Thicket or efvil posts of the month, you know, you were there. The forums got worse and worse to use, less and less accessible, more and more condensed and useless, and have not truly been fit for purpose by any stretch of the imagination for the best part of a decade.

I still keep in touch with those I can. Via Facebook, here on Pure, with a friendly greeting to any of the steadily decreasing numbers still on the client. A fraction of the old community, but a fraction that never has quite faded away.

Forums by Jyalt at Fri, 09/25/2015 - 19:10
Jyalt's picture

I had forum account a while ago. I stopped going to the forums when everything I posted was deleted within 10 minutes of it going up. I wasn't a troll. I frequently pointed out program bugs and known issues before they became widespread in the hopes they would be fixed faster. When it was a thriving community I had several friends like Random_Ranter and algona. Have to say, by the end I absolutely hated the mods. The forums were a very exclusive community... you could not write anything bad about wizards of the coast at all for your post to remain up. You could not ask about bugs or game policy or prizes or how a certain promo was chosen. Personally, I'm happy that ship finally sank.

I have to take exception to by Paul Leicht at Fri, 09/25/2015 - 19:24
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I have to take exception to that bit about not saying anything critical. My posts are full of criticism, implied and direct. The thing that got posts flagged was usually a matter of how hostile the tone of the post was. The Mods could be overzealous in their cleansing of the forums but they weren't arbitrary nor were those of us who didn't get all their posts deleted part of some elite club. We just used tact to have intelligent discourse rather than rant and rave.

That is where must agree to by Jyalt at Sun, 09/27/2015 - 19:26
Jyalt's picture

That is where must agree to disagree.

The people who didn't get their posts deleted praised wizards endlessly and agreed with company policy. I couldn't do that when I believed the program sucked. When I kept crashing out during early v3, I posted. They were deleted. I posted the bug that made me crash. It was moved to another forum, and then, later deleted by a different mod.

In fact, I had several threads that actually were intelligent discourse about the issues I raised, going about 15 posts. What happened to them? My posts were deleted by the next-mod-on-shift, AND the posts of the mod responding to me that quoted my posts were also deleted!

If you tried to talk about improving the program of MTGO on the boards of Wotc, your voice would be silenced.

That was definitely not my by Paul Leicht at Sun, 09/27/2015 - 20:01
Paul Leicht's picture

That was definitely not my experience at all.

Dunno, man. I railed at by BlippyTheSlug at Mon, 09/28/2015 - 08:37
BlippyTheSlug's picture

Dunno, man. I railed at wizzo's constantly, and was downright rude about it, and never had a post deleted...

http://community.wizards.com/content/forum-topic/3556031

I left because of WotC, not trolls. I believe that WotC coders can't program their way out of a paper bag,

I used to post in the forum by urzishra14 at Fri, 09/25/2015 - 19:34
urzishra14's picture

I used to post in the forum quite a bit. The Magic Online section was very useful and pretty awesome. I stopped going when I sold my collection the first time. But I tried to come back in the last few years, but it wasn't the same, most people had moved on and honestly forums just aren't what they used to be (for the best to be honest.)

TROLLING by Hearts at Sat, 09/26/2015 - 09:37
Hearts's picture

How much the alleged trolling isnt meant as trolling, but is trolling in (some) other peoples' eyes ?

How much of the forum communication receives criticism because of how different a 17 year old can see things versus how a 32 year old sees things ?

How much of the mtg rules and documents are prone for more than one interpretation in said situation(s) and thus create a stir among customers/players ? (read: jackie lee's articles/Sperling/PVDDR/bribery and collusion stuff/scouting/more...)

Farewell, Forums by Felorin at Sat, 09/26/2015 - 10:14
Felorin's picture

I wish I could say I miss the forums enough to be sad they're getting shut down. But I quit using them the last time they did a major re-do of the entire user interface that would make me have to re-learn where everything was and what to click on to get there. It wasn't the first one I'd been through, and I decided enough was enough.

Having seen the same with the website, MTGO art, color schemes and user interface, etc. I went back to the forums one last time to post "On Tearing Down Castles", which is, I feel, why the forums died. Here's a link to where it got reposted as a PureMTGO article.

http://puremtgo.com/articles/open-letter-wizards-tearing-down-castles

Maybe I am just missing by a small child at Sat, 09/26/2015 - 12:00
a small child's picture

Maybe I am just missing something but where do you see that the prize split rules only permit single elimination events?

“In the final round of an event, two players matched against each other may negotiate their match result to split whatever prizes are at stake between them, including (but not limited to) Qualifier Points and invitations. If an event cuts to a Top 8 playoff, the final round is defined as the last round of that playoff. Offering prizes outside those Magic Online would award based on the outcome of that match to the participants is still considered bribery, as is offering a prize split prior to the final round of an event.

All prize splits are done at the players' own risk, and Magic Online will not enforce any agreed-upon splits in any situation."

I don't see the phrase "single elimination" anywhere in that. It simply says "In the final round of an event."