I think what most people expect is this "When I use the Beta client, it's going to be a faster, easy to use interface, and will be almost exactly the same to use as the old client". Then reality happens. And reality is this: "The Beta client is completely different. It is slower and more difficult to use. This is not what I expected." So they are faced with 2 options: A) Use old client B) Use Beta client. It's not hard to imagine which option an overwhelming number of players will choose.
The only thing shocking about the beta is how bad it makes people feel, myself included. The rest: shoddy UI, bad graphics, lag, missing functionality and badly implemented functionality = business as usual since we have ALL been getting used to it for the last 10 months or so. Yes it's been 10months since the first Wide Beta.
This isn't merely culture shock. This a breaking of the paradigm of what people expect MAGIC Online to be. That would be fine if it was art (taste is subjective etc) but not so fine in a paid for product that people need to navigate daily in order to use without feeling robbed and ripped off.
I think some of this is what I have been saying about the Beta: It is designed for a very specific sub group of machines and players. Why that is, is beyond me but it clearly doesn't mesh with lots of players.
The new client just doesn't translate as smoothly to users that are used to the old client. When you log in for the first time, you really have to work to learn the new system, which is fine, but some of the things that are having to be relearned don't seem to be an improvement. Like the collection/deck building screen. On looks alone, it feels worse than the old client. It might be better than the old one, but it doesn't feel better using it the first time.
I'm willing to learn the new client, but if it keeps lagging on me then there is no reason to put myself in situations where I'm going to get frustrated at a program I'm trying to learn because it doesn't run as smoothly as the old client. My main issue is the lag. If I can get it to stop lagging on me, I will use the client.
Also, is the old client just that much worse than the Beta, or is that because you're more used to the Beta than the old client? What does the Beta do bettter? (besides drafts)
I think the reason for your confusion basically comes down to the "culture shock" of re-learning something which had previously been so familiar and comfortable. I agree that the beta client is fundamentally superior once you get used to it - performance issues aside, which I am hopeful are a product of this being a beta and will be fixed before release. Assuming they do fix various bugs and performance issues, this will be a step up once released and I believe people will come to realise that once they get over the initial shock of the new. After playing with the beta for the past 6 months or so, it's impossible for me to go back to the old one, it's just so bad.
Like I said, I'm willing to believe that what I experienced was atypical and that it runs more smoothly than expected. I played with the Beta Client a couple weeks ago, just before they released an update to the client.
As far as the notifications go, I was not aware that they were optional. I intended to use the Beta as if I had never used it and was being forced to do it (like today). If I had known that I could turn them off, I definitely would have.
As far as the targeting system goes, it could be just a matter of personal preference. The arrows stand out more to me than the highlights.
I wrote this before the last update so a few minor changes of note: Gideon is currently the only theme available as the MTGO team decided to remove the others until they can be truly fleshed out. As for why Gideon, it probably was just the most commonly used beforehand would be my guess. Some of the issues I mentioned in regards to changing what deck you wanted to play have been resolved as decks can be chosen now if formats are deselected. Finally, you can now just cancel a trade post instead of needing something there.
Just when you thought you had forgotten back bounces Flip
funny as we both quit about the same time sold up and moved on
So how strange that i find myself on a slow day at work and reading Pure to find you back and writing again
Best of luck Flip
And look me up online always seemed i was the new deck guinea pick for you :) but not as bingo, new account TurtleBeach (yeah ok i know but everything else i tried failed and i got to hate the name bingobongo)
I have to say, whenever I read these Beta Client tutorials I sometimes wonder what client these people are playing, since your experiences seem to be so much different than mine. In my experience the Beta Client is so much better than the old client that I cannot possibly imagine sticking with the old client when the new one is available. I solely use the Beta and have never missed the old client even once.
In particular, my mind boggled at the statement that the old client updates more quickly than the new one. For me, the old client takes FOREVER to update, while the beta updates in about a quarter of the time.
You do identify a few things which are accurate: the constant chat notifications are annoying, but they can be turned off (go to Account > Notifications). Hopefully they'll fix this default in the future. Having a separate chat window can be difficult, though the chat window can be docked to make it work like the old client (just drag it to the corner of the screen where you want to dock it). I usually just close the chat window until I need to say something. It does not automatically re-open, but you can open it at any time by clicking on the "Chat and Log" button (looks like a little speech balloon). And the new client is much more taxing on the CPU, which manifests as constant lag. This can also be ameliorated by turning off animations.
The other thing thing I strongly disagree with is the notion that targeting is better in the old client. The old client is an incomprehensible tangle of arrows, especially when there are multiple triggers on the stack. The new client is very clear. Mouse over the trigger to see the source highlighted in blue and the target(s) highlighted in orange. The other triggers and permanents which are not participating in the trigger are automatically darkened. This may be different than the old system, but in practice it's actually far easier to interpret.
The extra windows if closed stay closed. You can also dock them on any side of the screen (so chat on the right to replicate the old client if you want) so they lock inside the game window.
While I mostly agree with your assessment in general the notifications are optional. It is important that you check and change the default settings to how you want the client to behave because some of them are quite annoying.
On my machine, the one part of Shiny that actually works is draft. I will do a few NIX TIX drafts, but I'll wait until a functional client is running to trade away my draft leftovers.
I haven't ruled out logging on during the spotlight but it seems to me that little has changed so to do so will largely be an exercise in futility. As AJ has indicated the deck editor/Collection screens are still a nightmare for deck builders. If you are like us, you have thousands of deck lists that will not play well with the v4 client. Some of this has to do with issues regarding what types of cards (promos, foils, most recent sets) have priority in the editor and how it inflexibly deals with exceptions to these prioritized types of cards.
Welcome back. You were one of the very first writers that I have started to read the articles here on PureMTGO about 3-4 years ago. It's good to see you here again.
My computer is brand new this year and the beta client runs like crap. I can play pretty much anything I want to maxed out and v4 is laggy garbage on my system. If this isn't corrected before this steaming pile is forced on players like myself we will leave.
Forcing something in this format is a recipee for disaster. In my opinion the proper 2nd pick was the 2/5 Deathtouch creature. He has green and would have opened your deck to many great picks including the warped physique and some on color guildgates. He's great with an evolve deck and can really destroy an opponents board in the rigth situation. In the wrong situation he's a great blocker. Your deck could have been a powerful G/U/B deck.
I think what most people expect is this "When I use the Beta client, it's going to be a faster, easy to use interface, and will be almost exactly the same to use as the old client". Then reality happens. And reality is this: "The Beta client is completely different. It is slower and more difficult to use. This is not what I expected." So they are faced with 2 options: A) Use old client B) Use Beta client. It's not hard to imagine which option an overwhelming number of players will choose.
The only thing shocking about the beta is how bad it makes people feel, myself included. The rest: shoddy UI, bad graphics, lag, missing functionality and badly implemented functionality = business as usual since we have ALL been getting used to it for the last 10 months or so. Yes it's been 10months since the first Wide Beta.
This isn't merely culture shock. This a breaking of the paradigm of what people expect MAGIC Online to be. That would be fine if it was art (taste is subjective etc) but not so fine in a paid for product that people need to navigate daily in order to use without feeling robbed and ripped off.
I think some of this is what I have been saying about the Beta: It is designed for a very specific sub group of machines and players. Why that is, is beyond me but it clearly doesn't mesh with lots of players.
The new client just doesn't translate as smoothly to users that are used to the old client. When you log in for the first time, you really have to work to learn the new system, which is fine, but some of the things that are having to be relearned don't seem to be an improvement. Like the collection/deck building screen. On looks alone, it feels worse than the old client. It might be better than the old one, but it doesn't feel better using it the first time.
I'm willing to learn the new client, but if it keeps lagging on me then there is no reason to put myself in situations where I'm going to get frustrated at a program I'm trying to learn because it doesn't run as smoothly as the old client. My main issue is the lag. If I can get it to stop lagging on me, I will use the client.
Also, is the old client just that much worse than the Beta, or is that because you're more used to the Beta than the old client? What does the Beta do bettter? (besides drafts)
I think the reason for your confusion basically comes down to the "culture shock" of re-learning something which had previously been so familiar and comfortable. I agree that the beta client is fundamentally superior once you get used to it - performance issues aside, which I am hopeful are a product of this being a beta and will be fixed before release. Assuming they do fix various bugs and performance issues, this will be a step up once released and I believe people will come to realise that once they get over the initial shock of the new. After playing with the beta for the past 6 months or so, it's impossible for me to go back to the old one, it's just so bad.
Good to know about this one. I think it is interesting though. Good job on this. - YOR Health
Good to know this one. I think the prices are good though. - Carmack Moving and Storage
Like I said, I'm willing to believe that what I experienced was atypical and that it runs more smoothly than expected. I played with the Beta Client a couple weeks ago, just before they released an update to the client.
As far as the notifications go, I was not aware that they were optional. I intended to use the Beta as if I had never used it and was being forced to do it (like today). If I had known that I could turn them off, I definitely would have.
As far as the targeting system goes, it could be just a matter of personal preference. The arrows stand out more to me than the highlights.
Thanks again everyone, it means a lot :)
Some additional info:
I wrote this before the last update so a few minor changes of note: Gideon is currently the only theme available as the MTGO team decided to remove the others until they can be truly fleshed out. As for why Gideon, it probably was just the most commonly used beforehand would be my guess. Some of the issues I mentioned in regards to changing what deck you wanted to play have been resolved as decks can be chosen now if formats are deselected. Finally, you can now just cancel a trade post instead of needing something there.
Just when you thought you had forgotten back bounces Flip
funny as we both quit about the same time sold up and moved on
So how strange that i find myself on a slow day at work and reading Pure to find you back and writing again
Best of luck Flip
And look me up online always seemed i was the new deck guinea pick for you :) but not as bingo, new account TurtleBeach (yeah ok i know but everything else i tried failed and i got to hate the name bingobongo)
I have to say, whenever I read these Beta Client tutorials I sometimes wonder what client these people are playing, since your experiences seem to be so much different than mine. In my experience the Beta Client is so much better than the old client that I cannot possibly imagine sticking with the old client when the new one is available. I solely use the Beta and have never missed the old client even once.
In particular, my mind boggled at the statement that the old client updates more quickly than the new one. For me, the old client takes FOREVER to update, while the beta updates in about a quarter of the time.
You do identify a few things which are accurate: the constant chat notifications are annoying, but they can be turned off (go to Account > Notifications). Hopefully they'll fix this default in the future. Having a separate chat window can be difficult, though the chat window can be docked to make it work like the old client (just drag it to the corner of the screen where you want to dock it). I usually just close the chat window until I need to say something. It does not automatically re-open, but you can open it at any time by clicking on the "Chat and Log" button (looks like a little speech balloon). And the new client is much more taxing on the CPU, which manifests as constant lag. This can also be ameliorated by turning off animations.
The other thing thing I strongly disagree with is the notion that targeting is better in the old client. The old client is an incomprehensible tangle of arrows, especially when there are multiple triggers on the stack. The new client is very clear. Mouse over the trigger to see the source highlighted in blue and the target(s) highlighted in orange. The other triggers and permanents which are not participating in the trigger are automatically darkened. This may be different than the old system, but in practice it's actually far easier to interpret.
The extra windows if closed stay closed. You can also dock them on any side of the screen (so chat on the right to replicate the old client if you want) so they lock inside the game window.
While I mostly agree with your assessment in general the notifications are optional. It is important that you check and change the default settings to how you want the client to behave because some of them are quite annoying.
On my machine, the one part of Shiny that actually works is draft. I will do a few NIX TIX drafts, but I'll wait until a functional client is running to trade away my draft leftovers.
I'm a new writer here, but It's always nice to see someone beloved come back. So welcome back :)
Welcome back, Flips!
glad to have you back!
Thanks guys it feels good to be back :)
I've already got that deck building itch, so you will be seeing a lot more of me in the future.
Welcome back :) You've been missed both in game and on here.
I haven't ruled out logging on during the spotlight but it seems to me that little has changed so to do so will largely be an exercise in futility. As AJ has indicated the deck editor/Collection screens are still a nightmare for deck builders. If you are like us, you have thousands of deck lists that will not play well with the v4 client. Some of this has to do with issues regarding what types of cards (promos, foils, most recent sets) have priority in the editor and how it inflexibly deals with exceptions to these prioritized types of cards.
I will not be logging on during the Beta Spotlight. Is anyone else as excited about Hex as I am?
I really do love this card, I'm happy that it's finally getting some attention.
Welcome back. You were one of the very first writers that I have started to read the articles here on PureMTGO about 3-4 years ago. It's good to see you here again.
My computer is brand new this year and the beta client runs like crap. I can play pretty much anything I want to maxed out and v4 is laggy garbage on my system. If this isn't corrected before this steaming pile is forced on players like myself we will leave.
Forcing something in this format is a recipee for disaster. In my opinion the proper 2nd pick was the 2/5 Deathtouch creature. He has green and would have opened your deck to many great picks including the warped physique and some on color guildgates. He's great with an evolve deck and can really destroy an opponents board in the rigth situation. In the wrong situation he's a great blocker. Your deck could have been a powerful G/U/B deck.