There is a really good article on fighting Goblins in 100 singleton on www.mtgoacademy.com
Personally, I want to promote the format, and I think Goblins are a good way to do that because they are relatively cheap, they are competitive, and they fairly easy to learn how to play.
I've tried 3 color goblins with some success. If you're going for 5 colors though I wouldn't go with goblins. Goblins are good because they are consistent and if you are going to 5 colors you are going to lose a lot of consistency.
Good article. To be honest, though I was surprised. Thought I'd be seeing more "what do about the goblin menace" articles than an improvement article about them. As if they need the help :) Good left field option, always play with their minds.
Incidentally, if you're playing RW goblins Reveilark is a great option. It returns most of the obvious main players to play, wins on it's own, and can be an absurd source of card advantage - something Red and White really need.
the naming is a week off...I called the first one Armageddon Draws near. As far as allies i dont know how it got missed or why that would make 13 total wins.
We had merfolk win this past saturday and one allies entry is missing.
Ah...there was one time when i included two weeks in one article and didnt number that properly so there is another reason.
While Goblin Grenade is good, I don't think it's an auto-include card by any means.
Sacrificing a creature is a heavy cost, especially in a world filled with the greatest counterspells and wrath effects ever made.
For every game you win on turn 4-5 with a Goblin Grenade, there will be another game where Goblin Grenade will be a dead card or a 2 for 1 countered spell. Not to mention the times you'll want to use it to remove a blocker.
Don't get me wrong, it's a powerful spell, but in my mind it's not too much to pass up.
You can go many directions with each color and I tried to use this article to illustrate some of the ways you can go. I obviously can't hit everything with my sample decks. There are simply too many good classic cards.
Patriarch's Bidding and Living Death are very good against control matches. They are much less impressive against other aggro decks.
You certainly can change a couple of cards out and go for the mass recursion route. I simply chose a different route with my 5 casting cost cards in that deck.
I'm a bit confused when this "mythical" cleaning up of the Prismatic Banned list happened. Last I checked there are still plenty of cards that are banned that shouldn't be. There were several players myself included that wrote at length on the WotC boards numerous times all of us in near unanimous agreement on various cards and nothing ever changed. Sure there was a big revision to the B/R list, but it by no means fixed the list. They took a bunch of transmute stuff off, but then added cards like Eternal Witness, which were not harming anything. I do agree that WotC needs to ban fewer cards in these formats; the only cards that should be banned are the cards that are proving themselves to be a problem.
Good article Markus! Goblins do indeed lend themselves to a wide variety of strategies from the simple to the mindboggling. Kikimite is one of the nastiest instant speed combos out there. Particularly if you pester when your op is tapped out and then play kiki. When I first came back to MODO I had a friend pull that on me in extended. I was not pleased. Even so it is counterable with a squall or other mass damage card (volcanic fallout for example) so it isn't beyond broken. I wonder if there is a 5c goblins singleton deck possible, or if that would dilute the power of the creatures too much?
Heya Shard thanks for the mention. It should be noted that the imps deck that won was a combo intensive deck not really about the usual tribal stuff. And it came close to winning this week too even though I understand from sources that it was toned down a bit to be more casual.
R3G1, #2: While this is probably a fraction of a percent, I think you missed the best play here: bounce Lynx with your Skyfisher and loot it away. With Skyfisher in hand the Looter question expands from 'what's the card I least need in hand' to 'what's the card I least need in hand or in play', and Lynx clearly feels like that to me; it's not likely to attack profitably again this game (even Machete would go somewhere else!) and it's a tangibly worse blocker than Scholar if you find yourself forced into that position. The difference between Shepherd and Skyfisher + Looter #2 is actually fairly marginal here in terms of T5 plays, and I'd be eager to upgrade my Lynx to something that might actually impact the board.
All in all, though, excellent draft and excellent article!
You aren't giving Oath enough credit. It's a major archetype in vintage, and this should translate over into classic. It's easy to activate with Forbidden Orchard, and transmute gets it too.
Personally I've found it a very good anti-aggro card in prismatic singleton 100... nothing like oathing every turn against goblins or elves.
I think the decklist is very consistent, especially the sculler. I never believed in those decks that have 4 baneslayers as the only real dangerous creatures and then - amazement abound - the opponent still has about 3 removals in his hand when she hit the table. In Todd's deck the chance walletslayer sticks is pretty high...
I use a similar built however with Thornlings main instead of Master of the Wild Hunt. Guess a matter of personal preference.
I personally would go for 3 Emeria Angel max. It's best when it comes down while you either have a KOTR out or a fetchland in hand (i.e. later in the game that some people think - especially since strictly speaking it does not combine optimally with Lotus Cobra). Then having more than one Emeria in your hand is not very helpful.
I also prefer 2 Misty Rainforests instead of terramorphic expanse because I hate getting a hierarch in the opening hand and not being able to play it T1. Will there be W/G fetchlands in Worldwake?
I like Journey over Path in this deck as if you are up against a ast deck deck you really want to cast as early as possible without accelerating the opponent even more.
I wonder if there is a space for 2-3 grim discovery? It provides a sort of defence against blightning, a rescue if you're stuck with 2 mana as it can get the fetchlands from the graveyard and it is a great late game draw with emeria angel and/or thornling in the graveyard.
I have tried 4 duress in the sb and they are a blast, at least against control decks. Will stick with them for the time being. Other than that I'm not sure about the sideboard yet. What are the bad matchups for this deck?
Love the history, love the explanations of the plays! These types of articles make me excited to play a deck more than anything. It's too bad that as a combo, RecSur is already somehow more tickets than Oath + Forbidden Orchard. Otherwise I'd BuyItNow with overnight shipping. Of course, like you said, I'd surely pilot it wrong. But hey.
I was already familar with the Palinchron trick, but that was a good explanation of it. In paper you can kind of fudge it - just say "this is and this, I know it works and the result of each loop is X", and get away with it. You're just waving cardboard around. But online you actually have to click each step (and each loop -_-) of the combo, and the precise actions aren't clear.
There is a really good article on fighting Goblins in 100 singleton on www.mtgoacademy.com
Personally, I want to promote the format, and I think Goblins are a good way to do that because they are relatively cheap, they are competitive, and they fairly easy to learn how to play.
Thank you.
I've tried 3 color goblins with some success. If you're going for 5 colors though I wouldn't go with goblins. Goblins are good because they are consistent and if you are going to 5 colors you are going to lose a lot of consistency.
As good as they are, I really dislike unhygenic cards like Goblins. Going home to build a deck that absolutely crushes them! Good article btw.
Count me in :-)
I'd like to join the clan too! Mtgo: ofechner
Cheers
Good article. To be honest, though I was surprised. Thought I'd be seeing more "what do about the goblin menace" articles than an improvement article about them. As if they need the help :) Good left field option, always play with their minds.
Incidentally, if you're playing RW goblins Reveilark is a great option. It returns most of the obvious main players to play, wins on it's own, and can be an absurd source of card advantage - something Red and White really need.
the naming is a week off...I called the first one Armageddon Draws near. As far as allies i dont know how it got missed or why that would make 13 total wins.
We had merfolk win this past saturday and one allies entry is missing.
Ah...there was one time when i included two weeks in one article and didnt number that properly so there is another reason.
Am I missing something, if this is the report from the 10th seal how are there 11 wins?
dont include allies?? eh am sure i won with them, must of been dreaming :)
dont include allies?? eh am sure i won with them, must of been dreaming :)
While Goblin Grenade is good, I don't think it's an auto-include card by any means.
Sacrificing a creature is a heavy cost, especially in a world filled with the greatest counterspells and wrath effects ever made.
For every game you win on turn 4-5 with a Goblin Grenade, there will be another game where Goblin Grenade will be a dead card or a 2 for 1 countered spell. Not to mention the times you'll want to use it to remove a blocker.
Don't get me wrong, it's a powerful spell, but in my mind it's not too much to pass up.
You can go many directions with each color and I tried to use this article to illustrate some of the ways you can go. I obviously can't hit everything with my sample decks. There are simply too many good classic cards.
Patriarch's Bidding and Living Death are very good against control matches. They are much less impressive against other aggro decks.
You certainly can change a couple of cards out and go for the mass recursion route. I simply chose a different route with my 5 casting cost cards in that deck.
gots to have the goblin grenade.... 5 damage for R is too much to pass up.
the rogues list had a large quantity of faeries in it. As far as the Imp deck goes, if you click here flippers covered it in his article
http://puremtgo.com/articles/tribal-apocalypse-eighth-seal
I would really like to see that Imps list... :D
Also, no Faeries ? Are they soft-banned or just not good enough for Classic ?
I'm a bit confused when this "mythical" cleaning up of the Prismatic Banned list happened. Last I checked there are still plenty of cards that are banned that shouldn't be. There were several players myself included that wrote at length on the WotC boards numerous times all of us in near unanimous agreement on various cards and nothing ever changed. Sure there was a big revision to the B/R list, but it by no means fixed the list. They took a bunch of transmute stuff off, but then added cards like Eternal Witness, which were not harming anything. I do agree that WotC needs to ban fewer cards in these formats; the only cards that should be banned are the cards that are proving themselves to be a problem.
Good article Markus! Goblins do indeed lend themselves to a wide variety of strategies from the simple to the mindboggling. Kikimite is one of the nastiest instant speed combos out there. Particularly if you pester when your op is tapped out and then play kiki. When I first came back to MODO I had a friend pull that on me in extended. I was not pleased. Even so it is counterable with a squall or other mass damage card (volcanic fallout for example) so it isn't beyond broken. I wonder if there is a 5c goblins singleton deck possible, or if that would dilute the power of the creatures too much?
Heya Shard thanks for the mention. It should be noted that the imps deck that won was a combo intensive deck not really about the usual tribal stuff. And it came close to winning this week too even though I understand from sources that it was toned down a bit to be more casual.
No patriarch's bidding in br goblin list?
R3G1, #2: While this is probably a fraction of a percent, I think you missed the best play here: bounce Lynx with your Skyfisher and loot it away. With Skyfisher in hand the Looter question expands from 'what's the card I least need in hand' to 'what's the card I least need in hand or in play', and Lynx clearly feels like that to me; it's not likely to attack profitably again this game (even Machete would go somewhere else!) and it's a tangibly worse blocker than Scholar if you find yourself forced into that position. The difference between Shepherd and Skyfisher + Looter #2 is actually fairly marginal here in terms of T5 plays, and I'd be eager to upgrade my Lynx to something that might actually impact the board.
All in all, though, excellent draft and excellent article!
You aren't giving Oath enough credit. It's a major archetype in vintage, and this should translate over into classic. It's easy to activate with Forbidden Orchard, and transmute gets it too.
Personally I've found it a very good anti-aggro card in prismatic singleton 100... nothing like oathing every turn against goblins or elves.
he did 62 cards with 26 lands ;p
I think the decklist is very consistent, especially the sculler. I never believed in those decks that have 4 baneslayers as the only real dangerous creatures and then - amazement abound - the opponent still has about 3 removals in his hand when she hit the table. In Todd's deck the chance walletslayer sticks is pretty high...
I use a similar built however with Thornlings main instead of Master of the Wild Hunt. Guess a matter of personal preference.
I personally would go for 3 Emeria Angel max. It's best when it comes down while you either have a KOTR out or a fetchland in hand (i.e. later in the game that some people think - especially since strictly speaking it does not combine optimally with Lotus Cobra). Then having more than one Emeria in your hand is not very helpful.
I also prefer 2 Misty Rainforests instead of terramorphic expanse because I hate getting a hierarch in the opening hand and not being able to play it T1. Will there be W/G fetchlands in Worldwake?
I like Journey over Path in this deck as if you are up against a ast deck deck you really want to cast as early as possible without accelerating the opponent even more.
I wonder if there is a space for 2-3 grim discovery? It provides a sort of defence against blightning, a rescue if you're stuck with 2 mana as it can get the fetchlands from the graveyard and it is a great late game draw with emeria angel and/or thornling in the graveyard.
I have tried 4 duress in the sb and they are a blast, at least against control decks. Will stick with them for the time being. Other than that I'm not sure about the sideboard yet. What are the bad matchups for this deck?
Thanks a lot
Id also like to join the clan.
Mtgoname: bfossett
Love the history, love the explanations of the plays! These types of articles make me excited to play a deck more than anything. It's too bad that as a combo, RecSur is already somehow more tickets than Oath + Forbidden Orchard. Otherwise I'd BuyItNow with overnight shipping. Of course, like you said, I'd surely pilot it wrong. But hey.
I was already familar with the Palinchron trick, but that was a good explanation of it. In paper you can kind of fudge it - just say "this is and this, I know it works and the result of each loop is X", and get away with it. You're just waving cardboard around. But online you actually have to click each step (and each loop -_-) of the combo, and the precise actions aren't clear.