Flaming only occurs if you let it. :) I for one just explain that I am currently new to a format and that generally cuts the legs out from under any "N00b!" comments. If the rudeness continues the person gets blocked. I certainly wouldn't let someone else's ignorance of social decorum dissuade me from playing a format I like or am interested in investigating.
Yeah I loved Contract from Below but never got to really playing it irl. Only on Shandalar did I really get to exploit it to full effect. Ante in that game was crazy.
Whiffy fun article but you seem to have c/p a few bad spots. I noticed this when I was looking at your totals and they didn't change at all despite wins. Congrats on the Q.
I was recently invited to watch a new friend play a commander game and I thought I understood what it was until I sat and watched the game. Interesting format but it seems a bit on the degenerate side. The guy who invited me was playing mono blue bounce/control using Teferi as his legendary commander. His partner had to leave before I showed up so he was playing alone against two guys. One of them after realizing that this guy was playing MUB/C said he had enough of stall games and quit. The other guy whose deck was led by Malfegor continued on and eventually won. My impression was that the game seemed very uneven.
Anyway thanks for explaining some of the ins and outs of this format. I have been thinking of a Horde of Notions commander but I wonder if that is wise given the degenerate level of the playing field...Might be like bringing a tomahawk (axe not missile) to a Laser Cannon fight eh?
"The info is not helpful" - funny how that reminds me of your comment :) even if I strongly disagree with some ratings (Predatory Advantage has never seen my deck, ever, and I like playing G/R/x) the series is still very helpful. Ratings are never absolute, and if they just spread discussion in the forum I would still consider it helpful to newbies. My major concern with the series is rather that it is not actually timely, with ACR draft going towards the end of its lifecycle already. Probably the author can try to do the same, but earlier, for M10 :) ?
Season 4:
I played in 36 drafts and 1 Daily Event to get 15 QPs.
I spent 114 packs and won 96 packs in those events.
During that time I sold to bots cards for 138 tix.
I reached 15 QPs in 15 days 25th of June - 10th of July.
That I really like with commander is that it is a deckbuilders format. To build a really strong deck you need a ton of time and small changes can matter alot - e.g. Momir Vig + Wirewood Symbiote is really strong but not completely obivious without testing - for me anyway (the reason is Coiling Oracle. Who would know that a couple elves were enough for a "elf-lord" out of 100 singletons?).
I assume the decklist isn't updated recently/the article is a couple of weeks old (I mean Braids, Cabal Minion which is banned now adays). I suspect Kiki-Jiki, Mirrorbreaker/Imperial Recruiter would be a nice fit, except that they might be slightly expensive I suppose. Futheremore, no skullclamp (e.g. I think it is better when Mind's eye in your deck - and honestly most others)?
I think raw power is a bit more deficulty to explain - the way I see it - then you try to make it look. E.g. Rhys is a power house - he has atleast won a couple of the CK/MTGOtrader PREs - in a well constructed version of his deck (because alot of strong cards in those colors just happens to be efficent token generators/untappers/elves). Another would be Braids (the reason for the ban). A non-powerhouse tutor legend could be Captain Sisay. She is cheap (very important to me) and got a very strong tutor abillity (recurring tutors are deadly in the format), yet she isn't that good, because the legends in GW - or any 2 color combos - isn't that good for a toolbox (which seems to be the obvious approce) AND she is quite scary and eats a l o t of removel. I do not really think you can create a consistent category for raw power.
WotC created Standard to sell cards. That was, and still is, the primary reason it gets the lions share of support.
Think about how long and given set stays available for sale. There is a very concrete relationship between Standard and availability. Card sets are sold for two years and then retired. While you may still be able to get Lorwyn in a store after WotC stops selling it to retailers, players understand that it is time limited.
Standard is the most popular with players for several reasons including, but not limited to; the newness factor, the tournament support, and the marketing.
You mention Pauper as the other side format support, but pauper was healthy before WotC started support for it and it would continue to be healthy even if WotC now dropped support. Pauper has a thriving community. there are PRE's, 3rd party websites and articles all dealing with pauper and those wouldn't suddenly disappear if WotC stopped sanctioning pauper.
Prismatic never had a community. It had a few serious players and a slightly wider circle of casual players, but very little in the way of community. And I say this a a player who used to play Prismatic.
Weekly tournaments wouldn't be a panacea for prismatic. It's not like there's this grassroots wave of Prismatc fever just waiting to break free. I doubt there are more then a handful of players interested.
"Always fired until a year and a half before V3" kind of proves my point. It means that for a year and a half before the transition there wasn't enough interest. Plus, IIRC, it wasn't the time change that killed it, it was the fact that the tournaments went from 4x to 2X to 1x because at 4X the payout was bonkers even to the top 16, but at 1x it wasn't worth the effort for most players.
Look, I like Prismatic. I played Prismatic. I am probably one of the minority of players that have the capacity to build pretty much any competitive Pris deck. I do think it would be nice to have tournaments for it but I don't believe that WotC is going to offer them unless you can demonstrate to them that there is enough of a demand. One player, or two, or three, or even ten aren't enough to do that. Ten players do not a format make.
When I first started playing, Unlimited, we all played for ante. Then we stopped.... But we kept using the ante cards - effectively RFG them, but not handing them over. Contract from below was simply just too sexy a card to ignore. And we all had 4 of them.
I am suspicious of any argument that says "If WOTC did more of...." it would all work. At the end of the day, it takes people. People find a way. If it is interesting, entertaining etc. then it will catch on. Fads and such demonstrate the power of such.
It is also my experience that joining a game - multi or 1v1 in a format that you don't normally play, is more likely to end up in flaming than sticking to what you know. Where I can drop underworld dreams and FoW in classic, I get flamed for not dropping a reflecting pool in standard. (Who would pay that much for a land irrelevant in classic is my view, but that is b/c of what I play).
Prismatic has suffered from the same elitism. I have attempted to play half a dozen games in my time on mtgo and each time it has been the people, not the format, that have dissuaded me from playing further.
Brilliant. Well discussed. The Hat just ads to the austere, considered and dignified tone. No really.
Clans/communication can absolutely make or break your experience online.
My 2c would be that if you are putting yourself out there to connect with people, you had better be doing it in an environment that has the kind of boundaries and guidelines that ham is discussing here.
In an un-moderated, unclear, un-focussed environmet the Lord of the Flies phenomena will take over, it is inevitable. (Of course some clans actually seek to develop a Lord of the Flies envrionment, but that is another discussion.)
That being said, this site here, and other moderated sites like the wotc forums, and mtgsalvation provide exactly the kind of support to find that area of common interest discussed in this article.
The author clearly hasn't played much reborn cards to give his opinions are based on theory, not practice, like the other people who comment. They are better at recognizing when cards will table, when rebirth goes more often to the dome, that's the same for me. The info is not helpful, try telling stories with the cards you played. See how often minotaur actually kills flyers quite infrequent, and cycles more often.
I never even think about what lands I'm using... I guess most of my lands are time spiral or ravinica cuz those are the blox I played the most leagues in.
I really connected with your assement of this deck. I know so little about pauper but I have found my self doing the same thing in classic. I will say however that you maybe too against the idea, sure there were some fundamental proplems with the deck, but I think you have completely written it off and this style of deck building to soon.
After all new archtypes are created in all formats all the time, and sometimes it's not with new cards. In otherwords that square peg will eventually fit in the round hole even if its been ground down to a circle in the process of trying.
For a long while I was in an mature limited themed clan but we eventually all drifted apart....
Sadly, I don't know of any clans that are what you are looking for but I'll ask readers next week to shout out their clans so people can look for a fitting clan to join. Maybe we can track one down for you!
On rebirth, if we're in the pack where you take this,(pack 3) you should already be well committed to naya or jund. As far as fatties, both shards have their share, and there is always land cyclers.
Flaming only occurs if you let it. :) I for one just explain that I am currently new to a format and that generally cuts the legs out from under any "N00b!" comments. If the rudeness continues the person gets blocked. I certainly wouldn't let someone else's ignorance of social decorum dissuade me from playing a format I like or am interested in investigating.
Yeah I loved Contract from Below but never got to really playing it irl. Only on Shandalar did I really get to exploit it to full effect. Ante in that game was crazy.
Whiffy fun article but you seem to have c/p a few bad spots. I noticed this when I was looking at your totals and they didn't change at all despite wins. Congrats on the Q.
I was recently invited to watch a new friend play a commander game and I thought I understood what it was until I sat and watched the game. Interesting format but it seems a bit on the degenerate side. The guy who invited me was playing mono blue bounce/control using Teferi as his legendary commander. His partner had to leave before I showed up so he was playing alone against two guys. One of them after realizing that this guy was playing MUB/C said he had enough of stall games and quit. The other guy whose deck was led by Malfegor continued on and eventually won. My impression was that the game seemed very uneven.
Anyway thanks for explaining some of the ins and outs of this format. I have been thinking of a Horde of Notions commander but I wonder if that is wise given the degenerate level of the playing field...Might be like bringing a tomahawk (axe not missile) to a Laser Cannon fight eh?
have played a bit now but think a clan could help me take it to the next lv.
p.s would football hats be allowed
What bots do you guys like to sell packs and cards to?
"The info is not helpful" - funny how that reminds me of your comment :) even if I strongly disagree with some ratings (Predatory Advantage has never seen my deck, ever, and I like playing G/R/x) the series is still very helpful. Ratings are never absolute, and if they just spread discussion in the forum I would still consider it helpful to newbies. My major concern with the series is rather that it is not actually timely, with ACR draft going towards the end of its lifecycle already. Probably the author can try to do the same, but earlier, for M10 :) ?
Heres how I go to 15 QPs:
Season 4:
I played in 36 drafts and 1 Daily Event to get 15 QPs.
I spent 114 packs and won 96 packs in those events.
During that time I sold to bots cards for 138 tix.
I reached 15 QPs in 15 days 25th of June - 10th of July.
Wins:
1 OLS Swiss
4 XXX 4-3-2-2
3 SSE 4-3-2-2
3 ACR 4-3-2-2
1 ACR Swiss
1 Shadowmoor Daily event t4
Drafts:
12 wins
11 2nd
5 3-4th
8 5-8th
That I really like with commander is that it is a deckbuilders format. To build a really strong deck you need a ton of time and small changes can matter alot - e.g. Momir Vig + Wirewood Symbiote is really strong but not completely obivious without testing - for me anyway (the reason is Coiling Oracle. Who would know that a couple elves were enough for a "elf-lord" out of 100 singletons?).
I assume the decklist isn't updated recently/the article is a couple of weeks old (I mean Braids, Cabal Minion which is banned now adays). I suspect Kiki-Jiki, Mirrorbreaker/Imperial Recruiter would be a nice fit, except that they might be slightly expensive I suppose. Futheremore, no skullclamp (e.g. I think it is better when Mind's eye in your deck - and honestly most others)?
I think raw power is a bit more deficulty to explain - the way I see it - then you try to make it look. E.g. Rhys is a power house - he has atleast won a couple of the CK/MTGOtrader PREs - in a well constructed version of his deck (because alot of strong cards in those colors just happens to be efficent token generators/untappers/elves). Another would be Braids (the reason for the ban). A non-powerhouse tutor legend could be Captain Sisay. She is cheap (very important to me) and got a very strong tutor abillity (recurring tutors are deadly in the format), yet she isn't that good, because the legends in GW - or any 2 color combos - isn't that good for a toolbox (which seems to be the obvious approce) AND she is quite scary and eats a l o t of removel. I do not really think you can create a consistent category for raw power.
WotC created Standard to sell cards. That was, and still is, the primary reason it gets the lions share of support.
Think about how long and given set stays available for sale. There is a very concrete relationship between Standard and availability. Card sets are sold for two years and then retired. While you may still be able to get Lorwyn in a store after WotC stops selling it to retailers, players understand that it is time limited.
Standard is the most popular with players for several reasons including, but not limited to; the newness factor, the tournament support, and the marketing.
You mention Pauper as the other side format support, but pauper was healthy before WotC started support for it and it would continue to be healthy even if WotC now dropped support. Pauper has a thriving community. there are PRE's, 3rd party websites and articles all dealing with pauper and those wouldn't suddenly disappear if WotC stopped sanctioning pauper.
Prismatic never had a community. It had a few serious players and a slightly wider circle of casual players, but very little in the way of community. And I say this a a player who used to play Prismatic.
Weekly tournaments wouldn't be a panacea for prismatic. It's not like there's this grassroots wave of Prismatc fever just waiting to break free. I doubt there are more then a handful of players interested.
"Always fired until a year and a half before V3" kind of proves my point. It means that for a year and a half before the transition there wasn't enough interest. Plus, IIRC, it wasn't the time change that killed it, it was the fact that the tournaments went from 4x to 2X to 1x because at 4X the payout was bonkers even to the top 16, but at 1x it wasn't worth the effort for most players.
Look, I like Prismatic. I played Prismatic. I am probably one of the minority of players that have the capacity to build pretty much any competitive Pris deck. I do think it would be nice to have tournaments for it but I don't believe that WotC is going to offer them unless you can demonstrate to them that there is enough of a demand. One player, or two, or three, or even ten aren't enough to do that. Ten players do not a format make.
Shakey FTW. Great article about a really cool deck. Am going to build it, apologies to experience pilots at how badly I will drive it till i learn.
I like the LED less version, as this is the only deck I would buy LED for, and it doesn't need it.
bravo
Apologies for double post.
When I first started playing, Unlimited, we all played for ante. Then we stopped.... But we kept using the ante cards - effectively RFG them, but not handing them over. Contract from below was simply just too sexy a card to ignore. And we all had 4 of them.
I am suspicious of any argument that says "If WOTC did more of...." it would all work. At the end of the day, it takes people. People find a way. If it is interesting, entertaining etc. then it will catch on. Fads and such demonstrate the power of such.
It is also my experience that joining a game - multi or 1v1 in a format that you don't normally play, is more likely to end up in flaming than sticking to what you know. Where I can drop underworld dreams and FoW in classic, I get flamed for not dropping a reflecting pool in standard. (Who would pay that much for a land irrelevant in classic is my view, but that is b/c of what I play).
Prismatic has suffered from the same elitism. I have attempted to play half a dozen games in my time on mtgo and each time it has been the people, not the format, that have dissuaded me from playing further.
Brilliant. Well discussed. The Hat just ads to the austere, considered and dignified tone. No really.
Clans/communication can absolutely make or break your experience online.
My 2c would be that if you are putting yourself out there to connect with people, you had better be doing it in an environment that has the kind of boundaries and guidelines that ham is discussing here.
In an un-moderated, unclear, un-focussed environmet the Lord of the Flies phenomena will take over, it is inevitable. (Of course some clans actually seek to develop a Lord of the Flies envrionment, but that is another discussion.)
That being said, this site here, and other moderated sites like the wotc forums, and mtgsalvation provide exactly the kind of support to find that area of common interest discussed in this article.
Bravo, and applause.
Maybe you haven't, but I've actually had quite a bit of success with UW aggro.
Your build needs more Dazes :P
Get that more in focus and you've got an avatar :D
The author clearly hasn't played much reborn cards to give his opinions are based on theory, not practice, like the other people who comment. They are better at recognizing when cards will table, when rebirth goes more often to the dome, that's the same for me. The info is not helpful, try telling stories with the cards you played. See how often minotaur actually kills flyers quite infrequent, and cycles more often.
I never even think about what lands I'm using... I guess most of my lands are time spiral or ravinica cuz those are the blox I played the most leagues in.
Plus I got a hat!
As I said never an early pick :)
There needs to be a pirate hat wearing clan.... it's the obvious solution....
Funny thing I've been testing Culling Sun but it is sketchy
What factor would that be and why can't it be referred to for what reason?
Man, the riddles these people keep feeding us with....
You may try 2old2play clan. They are looking for casual players over 25. Sounds like what you're looking for.
LE
I really connected with your assement of this deck. I know so little about pauper but I have found my self doing the same thing in classic. I will say however that you maybe too against the idea, sure there were some fundamental proplems with the deck, but I think you have completely written it off and this style of deck building to soon.
After all new archtypes are created in all formats all the time, and sometimes it's not with new cards. In otherwords that square peg will eventually fit in the round hole even if its been ground down to a circle in the process of trying.
That's way more difficult than it should be. :(
For a long while I was in an mature limited themed clan but we eventually all drifted apart....
Sadly, I don't know of any clans that are what you are looking for but I'll ask readers next week to shout out their clans so people can look for a fitting clan to join. Maybe we can track one down for you!
On rebirth, if we're in the pack where you take this,(pack 3) you should already be well committed to naya or jund. As far as fatties, both shards have their share, and there is always land cyclers.