I see this italy thing as a way for them to get more people to play and draft. My problem is, it is virtually impossible for most players to haev any chance at all, regardless of skill level. I consistently have an 1800+ limited rating, and win the majority of the time i draft, but there is no way Im going to even try for the trip. Maybe a few people are, but the majority of us have jobs/a life/bills/etc. 50 drafts is a huge amount of time(also 750$). While I still draft occasionally, I will not be spending large amounts on wotc until they have put out a program that 1) WORKS!, 2)Works!, and mostly 3) WORKS!.
The program is still a buggy piece of junk even after a year.
Hey, this is AJ Sacher aka Phish4. The Ziggurat build was quite good for a long time, but it's time of dominance has passed. I cut the Ziggies and jammed 4 Elspeth and have been having moderate success with it. The original aggro list was given to me by Owen Turtenwald. I then put Naya Charms into it and had a good run. The problem now is that all of the other Naya decks are going bigger and bigger, jamming Coups main and quad Battlegrace angel. The problem with this is that those changes are literally only good against the "mirror". So until people realize that they're scooping to 5c instead of destroying it, the more aggressive version of the deck can't thrive.
The mirror comes down to who can keep a sdt on the table in my oppoinion.
there are plenty of built in wyas to fight an oppsing balance but really who ever can get the better card quality will generally win out.
I especially like your reasoning on what to play vs. time and cost. I am really looking forward to the second piece. I would love to qualify, but the time involvement is a bit steep for me. Having a job/family/playing in RL (ie. with pants) and all. They already bug me about my "habit"...
I'd play 8-4s once you get more polished, not only is it easier to go infinite, but you can split for QPs. I think I would've qualified for the monthly tournament had I not given my opponents the win with 3rd round splits countless times since I don't play constructed.
Love that advice - it's so true. A lot of times you are looking at only 1 mana available, in order to pressure the opponent (or take pressure off yourself.
It's especially important to remember when you have Trinket Mage/Trygon Predator on top to keep Grip from resolving, because you don't get a chance to look again.
It has unforeseen implications for multiplayer formats as a political utility or ally assist, as well as being removal and a seriously impressive tempo tool.
From my experience LOurs is absolutely correct. Winning a mirror match when your opponent has in-play Counterbalance/Top and you don't is EXTREMELY difficult. The mirror match largely comes down to a race to resolve this combo, and then a secondary race to either draw Krosan Grip or keep it on top of your library to protect your lock.
In the cases where Counterbalance/Top is disrupted or doesn't show up for either player, then the best route to victory that I have found is Dark Confidant card advantage - obviously preferably alongside Sensei's Divning Top. This not only increases your ability to draw into the lock, but also increases the ammunition that you have available in the cases where your opponent draws into the lock.
The problem, as mentioned above, is that 4x Swords to Plowshares is all over the place and Dark Confidant is often not long for this world.
Interesting article, interesting read. Hope to see the rest of the series. Given the number of drafts The quick recaps are just fine, interesting cards, play highlights and etc. Good work so far.
a mirror of countertop deck could be compared to a sprint race : the first player who manages to resolve the full lock is almost all the time the winner. In a mirror, you will see a turn (T2 or T3 usualy) where there is a big war of counters (it happens to double FoW +Daze, or even double FoW + double Daze) when a player is trying to implement the lock. This is a "tempo war" in fact.
Trygon could be a breakdown also, but most of countertop deck are running a full playset of swords to plowshare, so it is more complicated to keep the trygon on the board than to lock the opponent ... and finish it with mishra or something else...
I have no knowledge about the format and all I know about this deck comes from these articles. But I'm wondering: What kind of a game is CounterTop vs CounterTop? How does one win? What are the important cards for the miror match and how to play? He who gets down a Trygon Predator first and keeps it alive wins?
Oh too Teferi helps to stop the hard counters on your turn when you do try to kill the counterbalance after they have run out of mana or put sensei on top.
This article is very, very important to someone who wants to join competitive classic. Any classic player's deck must consider that he would have to beat a countertop the win a tournament. So this article wont learn revolutionnary technics to most of usual classic player, but this is nuts for any player joining the format.
About solutions, i maybe could add something to this great analyzis with another angle.
Solution #1, #2 & #4 are tempo solutions : a usual countertop deck is running x4 counterbalance & x4 top. So to counter, to destroy or to make discard one of the needed element wont prevent you from a middle/late lock. (if you destroy the counterbalance, the top will help the opponent to find another one and if you destroy the top, you are still sensitive to counterbalance counters). So you have to consider theses solution if you only need a few turns to win before the lock comes again on board(if you are running vial, combo, rdw or any fast deck ...)
Solution #3, #5, & #6 are general blue hate solution : these options are viable against almost any blue decks, countertop included as well. They are also the most efficient solution imho if you are scared by blue counters.
Solution #7 & #8 are specific anticipations vs countertop : The Rock's players know that countertop is harmful for them (for example, true with some other decks too) so they anticipate the lock during the conception of the deck to have a protection against it. Most of The Rock deck are playing 3 or 4 mana spell (doran, kitchen, loxodon hierarch,vindicate, pernicious ...) because of the countertop : some theses cards could be replaced by some faster other spell, but wont be in order to be free to play them even if the lock is already on board.
Solution #9 is not a real solution : it is a question to well manage priorities in a classic deck. The aim is not to harm to this usual lock, but still to win the game...
Some counterbalance-top players main deck pithing needle, and it renders Shusher useless, although he is still a good strategy, you have to watch out for that as well.
Thanks for writing. I'd like to see the rest. I qualified at about the same win ratio as you, though I played two PEs for 6 points (and whiffed on two others).
You do have to mulligan aggressively with the Naya Ziggurat deck, but it has placed well due to the power of quick beats backed by Naya Charm to tap down the opposing team. Naya Charm dominates the mirror match.
However since the writing of this article the deck has actually moved away from Ancient Ziggurat in favor of a full set of Jungle Shrine and a couple Exotic Orchard so that it can run Elspeth to give it additional reach through the air.
The content is pretty interesting (which is the most important though) but honestly i think the article has to look better. Some picture, some table (even if not really required) would make the read easier and funnier. Only my opinion. Nice article anyway.
I like the first concept a lot, very original and it could be effective in this format indeed. Assuming the deck is a budget deck, maybe you could add 1 or 2 Urami tomb (nice to put a 5/5 creature in play and the drawback isnt harmful because you got the perfect deck to replace destroyed lands and especialy good to lauch a big worm harvest offensive). I would also consider Kher Keep to give a fast little defense against quick agression :)
In both of the others decks, i think this little common card from reborn would fit very well into them :
Bolt of Intimidation - 1RW
Instant (Uncommon)
Bolt of Intimidation deals 3 damage to target creature. Other creatures can't attack this turn.
Years back, the waybackmachine.com had an archive, but that seems to be missing as well. YOu could try Google - I only checked the first few pages.
I see this italy thing as a way for them to get more people to play and draft. My problem is, it is virtually impossible for most players to haev any chance at all, regardless of skill level. I consistently have an 1800+ limited rating, and win the majority of the time i draft, but there is no way Im going to even try for the trip. Maybe a few people are, but the majority of us have jobs/a life/bills/etc. 50 drafts is a huge amount of time(also 750$). While I still draft occasionally, I will not be spending large amounts on wotc until they have put out a program that 1) WORKS!, 2)Works!, and mostly 3) WORKS!.
The program is still a buggy piece of junk even after a year.
And yes, you have to mulligan quite aggressively to have success with the Ziggurat build.
Hey, this is AJ Sacher aka Phish4. The Ziggurat build was quite good for a long time, but it's time of dominance has passed. I cut the Ziggies and jammed 4 Elspeth and have been having moderate success with it. The original aggro list was given to me by Owen Turtenwald. I then put Naya Charms into it and had a good run. The problem now is that all of the other Naya decks are going bigger and bigger, jamming Coups main and quad Battlegrace angel. The problem with this is that those changes are literally only good against the "mirror". So until people realize that they're scooping to 5c instead of destroying it, the more aggressive version of the deck can't thrive.
That's my take, anyway.
The mirror comes down to who can keep a sdt on the table in my oppoinion.
there are plenty of built in wyas to fight an oppsing balance but really who ever can get the better card quality will generally win out.
I especially like your reasoning on what to play vs. time and cost. I am really looking forward to the second piece. I would love to qualify, but the time involvement is a bit steep for me. Having a job/family/playing in RL (ie. with pants) and all. They already bug me about my "habit"...
I'd play 8-4s once you get more polished, not only is it easier to go infinite, but you can split for QPs. I think I would've qualified for the monthly tournament had I not given my opponents the win with 3rd round splits countless times since I don't play constructed.
good article, keep it up.
Love that advice - it's so true. A lot of times you are looking at only 1 mana available, in order to pressure the opponent (or take pressure off yourself.
It's especially important to remember when you have Trinket Mage/Trygon Predator on top to keep Grip from resolving, because you don't get a chance to look again.
It has unforeseen implications for multiplayer formats as a political utility or ally assist, as well as being removal and a seriously impressive tempo tool.
From my experience LOurs is absolutely correct. Winning a mirror match when your opponent has in-play Counterbalance/Top and you don't is EXTREMELY difficult. The mirror match largely comes down to a race to resolve this combo, and then a secondary race to either draw Krosan Grip or keep it on top of your library to protect your lock.
In the cases where Counterbalance/Top is disrupted or doesn't show up for either player, then the best route to victory that I have found is Dark Confidant card advantage - obviously preferably alongside Sensei's Divning Top. This not only increases your ability to draw into the lock, but also increases the ammunition that you have available in the cases where your opponent draws into the lock.
The problem, as mentioned above, is that 4x Swords to Plowshares is all over the place and Dark Confidant is often not long for this world.
Menu -> Settings > Game Play: [X] Enable Draft Recorder in "Advanced Settings"
On my machine (Windows Vista) the files are stored in:
C:\Users\\Documents\Games\Magic The Gathering Online\Drafts
Menu -> Settings > Game Play: [X] Enable Draft Recorder in "Advanced Settings"
On my machine (Windows Vista) the files are stored in:
C:\Users\\Documents\Games\Magic The Gathering Online\Drafts
Interesting article, interesting read. Hope to see the rest of the series. Given the number of drafts The quick recaps are just fine, interesting cards, play highlights and etc. Good work so far.
a mirror of countertop deck could be compared to a sprint race : the first player who manages to resolve the full lock is almost all the time the winner. In a mirror, you will see a turn (T2 or T3 usualy) where there is a big war of counters (it happens to double FoW +Daze, or even double FoW + double Daze) when a player is trying to implement the lock. This is a "tempo war" in fact.
Trygon could be a breakdown also, but most of countertop deck are running a full playset of swords to plowshare, so it is more complicated to keep the trygon on the board than to lock the opponent ... and finish it with mishra or something else...
I have no knowledge about the format and all I know about this deck comes from these articles. But I'm wondering: What kind of a game is CounterTop vs CounterTop? How does one win? What are the important cards for the miror match and how to play? He who gets down a Trygon Predator first and keeps it alive wins?
Just wondering.
LE
Oh too Teferi helps to stop the hard counters on your turn when you do try to kill the counterbalance after they have run out of mana or put sensei on top.
This article is very, very important to someone who wants to join competitive classic. Any classic player's deck must consider that he would have to beat a countertop the win a tournament. So this article wont learn revolutionnary technics to most of usual classic player, but this is nuts for any player joining the format.
About solutions, i maybe could add something to this great analyzis with another angle.
Solution #1, #2 & #4 are tempo solutions : a usual countertop deck is running x4 counterbalance & x4 top. So to counter, to destroy or to make discard one of the needed element wont prevent you from a middle/late lock. (if you destroy the counterbalance, the top will help the opponent to find another one and if you destroy the top, you are still sensitive to counterbalance counters). So you have to consider theses solution if you only need a few turns to win before the lock comes again on board(if you are running vial, combo, rdw or any fast deck ...)
Solution #3, #5, & #6 are general blue hate solution : these options are viable against almost any blue decks, countertop included as well. They are also the most efficient solution imho if you are scared by blue counters.
Solution #7 & #8 are specific anticipations vs countertop : The Rock's players know that countertop is harmful for them (for example, true with some other decks too) so they anticipate the lock during the conception of the deck to have a protection against it. Most of The Rock deck are playing 3 or 4 mana spell (doran, kitchen, loxodon hierarch,vindicate, pernicious ...) because of the countertop : some theses cards could be replaced by some faster other spell, but wont be in order to be free to play them even if the lock is already on board.
Solution #9 is not a real solution : it is a question to well manage priorities in a classic deck. The aim is not to harm to this usual lock, but still to win the game...
Take care mate, great work and looks good.
Some counterbalance-top players main deck pithing needle, and it renders Shusher useless, although he is still a good strategy, you have to watch out for that as well.
Thanks for writing. I'd like to see the rest. I qualified at about the same win ratio as you, though I played two PEs for 6 points (and whiffed on two others).
Cool article. I like it. Early (based on this article) congrats on qualifying :)
...Burning Tree Shaman?
He's uber-aggro, vialable, and really nails the Top Player to the wall. Good against Sensei-Sensei as well.
Good article on how to approach beating a very irritating deck!
You do have to mulligan aggressively with the Naya Ziggurat deck, but it has placed well due to the power of quick beats backed by Naya Charm to tap down the opposing team. Naya Charm dominates the mirror match.
However since the writing of this article the deck has actually moved away from Ancient Ziggurat in favor of a full set of Jungle Shrine and a couple Exotic Orchard so that it can run Elspeth to give it additional reach through the air.
The content is pretty interesting (which is the most important though) but honestly i think the article has to look better. Some picture, some table (even if not really required) would make the read easier and funnier. Only my opinion. Nice article anyway.
I like the first concept a lot, very original and it could be effective in this format indeed. Assuming the deck is a budget deck, maybe you could add 1 or 2 Urami tomb (nice to put a 5/5 creature in play and the drawback isnt harmful because you got the perfect deck to replace destroyed lands and especialy good to lauch a big worm harvest offensive). I would also consider Kher Keep to give a fast little defense against quick agression :)
In both of the others decks, i think this little common card from reborn would fit very well into them :
Bolt of Intimidation - 1RW
Instant (Uncommon)
Bolt of Intimidation deals 3 damage to target creature. Other creatures can't attack this turn.