Does anyone know if Kataki, War's Wage sees much of a presence on Magic Online sideboards nowadays in Modern? Tom Ross seems not to fear Affinity enough to justify a slot in his paper deck, preferring more flexible hate options.
As to Magic Online, in the GW Tron vs Lantern Control matchup, I'd expect Kataki to be potent, because the need to pay all that mana each upkeep would almost certainly time-out the Lantern Control player (both in terms of reducing the Lantern Control player's available mana, but also by forcing the lantern player to click hundreds more times throughout a match).
I believe he did quite well against both but that could be because he knew the match ups and is very good player. This version of Tron does seem to have better answers against those decks though.
Generally everything went pretty well. Linvala was excellent at shutting down the finely crafted Shaman deck, whose Deathrites were otherwise doing an excellent job. Magister of Worth with Avacyn out is everything I love about the game. Hats off to MisterMojoRising: He had a very small window of opportunity, but really made the most of it, and he recovered well from nearly tilting after sacrificing a win condition.
Promo codes: They should be to create a new account or a free draft for accounts created within a week. Otherwise all the MTGO players buy the codes off non-MTGO players at the GP.
The maximum value of boosters is $3.33. Otherwise you pay 12 tix to enter the draft not sealed product.
Great article. It's nice to see a build of Tron which seems it would put a better fight against Infect and Affinity post-board. I would love to know if Tom Ross was able to achieve a greater than 50% win rate against those 2 decks, both matchups of which are traditionally very tough for Tron.
I also like the switch deck term better but unfortunately in Magic there are so many things going on that it is difficult to draw the line somewhere. In games where you have different well set win conditions it is easier. For example in L5R I used to play Honor switch decks that could switch from Honor win condition (being control or combo) to a Military win condition (aggro).
Delver wouldn't be Tempo Switch deck but an Aggro-Switch deck. Tempo in Magic is 'the fact of gaining or losing position and productivity in relation to victory.' and has nothing to do with how we actually win. Many decks try to gain tempo in order to win. 'tempo' decks do it in a more proactive way because they need to diminish the discrepancy between 'power' of cards of opponent's deck (and their deck). See, if tempo between a Delver deck and Jund would be the same, Jund would win because of the sheer power of its cards.
I know this is clear to you but I just wanted to demonstrate somehow the fact that if you switch roles, the tempo deck becomes something different (I described this in part 3). If the tempo deck switches to control it wouldn't be called a tempo deck because it totally abandons the way how it gains tempo. The deck would have been called Aggro-switch (sounds horrible). Aggro because that is the role you start with and want to stick with. Switch because you can become control, that alone shows you have the means to gain tempo in both roles.
As for JVP. I talk about Jace in part 3 of this series as well. Each card has its advantages and disadvantages. While Snapcaster Mage is certainly better in Modern, in Vintage it is not clear. There are Vintage decks that play the card and in which the card is actually good but you have to be more on the big blue side of decks, play Mentor or landstill. Decks like URx Delver can't afford playing the card. 1 copy is often too much, doesn't mean you can't play the card. These decks operate on 2 mana sources most of the time so playing something for more at instant speed is almost impossible. It was always the last card I had in my hand unless I pitched it earlier. On the other hand Jace does so much more and repeatedly and costs only 2 mana to cast. It gains tempo on all axes and I don't know if there is any other card like that. For me the card seems pretty overpowered. I don't know what it costs now I was getting the card when it cost 70tix and went up to over 90tix a bit later. The card was that good! It's like Liliana of the Veil or Jace, the Mind Sculptor with the exception that you can play the card in way more different decks. It can make the decks work, it can make the decks way more powerful. I ended up playing with the card in decks that did not play blue. Just jammed fetches there and played the card. Maybe I overdid that a bit (that's what I thought at that time) but I learned that the decks became better with offcolor JVP.
When I started playing with JVP I wondered if this card is not better than Jace, the Mind Sculptor (or Lili). In vacuum JTMS is better but JVP is very versatile card that makes so many decks way better and since it costs two mana it can find home in more decks than JTMS. The card is just insane and even you can use its ultimate ability to win the game. That is something I did not even consider when I got so mesmerized by this card (that was pretty overlooked and underrated at that time). So I can't really say much about the card being 'over played'. I'm actually surprised that more people do not play the card.
I think that Jace, Vryn's Prodigy is not explored enough by many players. The card is very strong but very difficult to play with. Not that it would be easier to play with JTMS. I observed this when the card was legal in Standard.
I played 3 Ojutai's Commands, 3 Kolaghan's Commands, 4 JVPs ... just to simply have access to Jace. When the card managed to stay in play it just won the game! Similarly to how it was when people played Caw-Blade. I played Jace Beleren cards just to get rid of JTMS so I could land my own copy of JTMS and win. It took people long time to understand how ultimately good the card is (JTMS).
But don't worry you are not the only one. Many people do not like JVP and there is also many places JVP simply does not fit. I adore Snapcaster Mage and it was often the card I'd name 'my most favorite card' while I would never think of JVP. Sometimes there simply isn't room for Snapcaster Mage in a deck and other cards are better. When JTMS got banned I started playing Seagate Oracle to replace it^_^. I'd replace Snapcaster Mage with Preordain if I wouldn't have played 4 already or Flusterstorm/Spell Pierce. Because those are the effects Snapcaster Mage was good at. But it wasn't worth 3 mana and 2/1 body.
Note this is subjective and is my opinion but it all stems from my experience playing those cards and different decks^_^.
I think you are right. There is a likely bias in the responses. But since Lee is asking in the first place I guess there is some issue with attendence.
You logic sounds good. As I remember the popular opinion earlier on it was something like cross pod pairing would make no difference. Or maybe it was hate drafting would make no difference which might still be true.
Obviously I don't agree with the assertion that TWL is too much work to maintain. I do agree though that some moderate lip service to the casual crowd would probably have a far out of proportion positive impact, especially since we are starting to seem like an unwanted family member.
Not sure how I feel about the latest hot thing: Old school being the pick for this. Particularly since it is only partially online I see it as being less desirable than other possible formats but any challenging deck building format is going to be at least somewhat interesting at least until we discover how solved it is.
As to courage,O' Lion, it is within you. You simply must acknowledge what it is you truly want and you will find plenty of courage to get it done.
Interesting and indepth analysis of your evolution as a delver player. I like the term "switch deck". It sure beats the old timer "Aggro-Control" which is more about the role the player is in than the deck they are playing. (I like aggro control decks BECAUSE they are switch decks so why not call them that?) Brilliant nomenclature.
Question: since Delver is a tempo deck, and a switch deck is it fair to call it a 'Tempo Switch' deck?
I have to say, I absolutely loath Jace the Flippant. I don't know why precisely, but I do. From the very first I saw him, I said "that's a card I don't want to play." Maybe I am crazy. Seems like I'm in the minority at the very least. It is imho an over priced, over played hack of a card. But it does what it does so hey. On the other hand I adore snapcaster, even though it rarely brings the beat down in any meaningful way.
This may be more of a case where the ones opposed to cross-pod pairing are vocal and those that don't care are silent.
Logically it should be easier to 3-0 a pod by cutting the other drafters from the "best" deck, whereas in a league, the cream of many pods rises to the top, so you would face a top deck from another pod, rather than the 2nd best deck in your own pod.
I saw Lee S ask on twitter why people dont like draft leagues. All answers point to a dislike for cross pod pairing.
We should get a revised opinion section on this. As far as I remember most comments here and on reddit suggested that cross pod pairing should not be an issue. Then why are people complaining?
A lot of the problem is that the bots can't acquire them directly; you have to play to get them. There are also a lot fewer cards overall, even compared to the LCPPs--and those packs didn't have many good Constructed-relevant new cards (though Meren has somehow risen to $24, despite the presumed lack of casual demand on MTGO). As for the cards themselves, I'm surprised Leovold is the most-expensive--people do realize rares and mythics are supposed to have the same rarity level, right? Atraxa is also another casual hit that apparently managed to have some value on MTGO.
(also, another reason prices might be so high is that MTGOTraders values having stock of basically every card, so it paid a premium to get that stock, and for some reason the price has held so far)
Goblin and Elf are close to over their sustainable tipping points without their marquee cards. They'll come back a bit as other tribes take over and are pruned. Humans, of course, are so dense that they have a long way to go yet. But the system works. Pure is great since it's the only format that tribes like Kithkin or Treefolk will have a chance to be good in one day.
While I think Modern Tribal is probably fine as a format, I'd personally rather not replace Pure with it simply because of the additional cost of creating or refitting decks for a new format, plus losing access to the budget land-base of the Mirage fetches + cheap dual lands.
Maybe we could move the exiler illegality (and some other restrictions) to Underdog?
Or we could reform Pure as a fixed format rather than an evolving one (maybe with Human-Elf-Goblin outright banned as tribes), and alternate it with Modern.
Nah, taking on legacy decks with tribal decks is a great way to see how well you do in adverse conditions. If you can make it there, you can make it anywhere.
I can't speak for Modern (sorry, something came up), but Pure feels very different to me than Regular. #1 reason is absence of Swords to Plowshares, #2 is legalitiy issues (many combos are flat out illegal under Pure) but there are several others.
Do you think Treasure Chests are going to keep being valuable? It seems like the prize content in them has increased lately and I wonder if that was a temporary move to generate some buzz about them. I don't dislike the idea completely, but I feel that the problem was that they were taking a known-value prize and swapping it for something that could be worthless. If the chests feel like a bonus, people will like them.
There is one other major issue with this approach though. Most of the new cards that have been released via Chests are worthless to constructed players and the few that are of interest to spikes are insanely expensive and hard to get right now. Everyone wants to finally test Leovold Emissary of Trest and it's over seventy tickets!
Does anyone know if Kataki, War's Wage sees much of a presence on Magic Online sideboards nowadays in Modern? Tom Ross seems not to fear Affinity enough to justify a slot in his paper deck, preferring more flexible hate options.
As to Magic Online, in the GW Tron vs Lantern Control matchup, I'd expect Kataki to be potent, because the need to pay all that mana each upkeep would almost certainly time-out the Lantern Control player (both in terms of reducing the Lantern Control player's available mana, but also by forcing the lantern player to click hundreds more times throughout a match).
I believe he did quite well against both but that could be because he knew the match ups and is very good player. This version of Tron does seem to have better answers against those decks though.
Generally everything went pretty well. Linvala was excellent at shutting down the finely crafted Shaman deck, whose Deathrites were otherwise doing an excellent job. Magister of Worth with Avacyn out is everything I love about the game. Hats off to MisterMojoRising: He had a very small window of opportunity, but really made the most of it, and he recovered well from nearly tilting after sacrificing a win condition.
Promo codes: They should be to create a new account or a free draft for accounts created within a week. Otherwise all the MTGO players buy the codes off non-MTGO players at the GP.
The maximum value of boosters is $3.33. Otherwise you pay 12 tix to enter the draft not sealed product.
https://twitter.com/MagicOnline/status/715599387192344576
Due to bugs affecting Millikin and Mana Bloom, these cards have been replaced with Manakin and Nylea's Presence in the Legendary Cube. #MTGO
10:59 AM - 31 Mar 2016
Great article. It's nice to see a build of Tron which seems it would put a better fight against Infect and Affinity post-board. I would love to know if Tom Ross was able to achieve a greater than 50% win rate against those 2 decks, both matchups of which are traditionally very tough for Tron.
I also like the switch deck term better but unfortunately in Magic there are so many things going on that it is difficult to draw the line somewhere. In games where you have different well set win conditions it is easier. For example in L5R I used to play Honor switch decks that could switch from Honor win condition (being control or combo) to a Military win condition (aggro).
Delver wouldn't be Tempo Switch deck but an Aggro-Switch deck. Tempo in Magic is 'the fact of gaining or losing position and productivity in relation to victory.' and has nothing to do with how we actually win. Many decks try to gain tempo in order to win. 'tempo' decks do it in a more proactive way because they need to diminish the discrepancy between 'power' of cards of opponent's deck (and their deck). See, if tempo between a Delver deck and Jund would be the same, Jund would win because of the sheer power of its cards.
I know this is clear to you but I just wanted to demonstrate somehow the fact that if you switch roles, the tempo deck becomes something different (I described this in part 3). If the tempo deck switches to control it wouldn't be called a tempo deck because it totally abandons the way how it gains tempo. The deck would have been called Aggro-switch (sounds horrible). Aggro because that is the role you start with and want to stick with. Switch because you can become control, that alone shows you have the means to gain tempo in both roles.
As for JVP. I talk about Jace in part 3 of this series as well. Each card has its advantages and disadvantages. While Snapcaster Mage is certainly better in Modern, in Vintage it is not clear. There are Vintage decks that play the card and in which the card is actually good but you have to be more on the big blue side of decks, play Mentor or landstill. Decks like URx Delver can't afford playing the card. 1 copy is often too much, doesn't mean you can't play the card. These decks operate on 2 mana sources most of the time so playing something for more at instant speed is almost impossible. It was always the last card I had in my hand unless I pitched it earlier. On the other hand Jace does so much more and repeatedly and costs only 2 mana to cast. It gains tempo on all axes and I don't know if there is any other card like that. For me the card seems pretty overpowered. I don't know what it costs now I was getting the card when it cost 70tix and went up to over 90tix a bit later. The card was that good! It's like Liliana of the Veil or Jace, the Mind Sculptor with the exception that you can play the card in way more different decks. It can make the decks work, it can make the decks way more powerful. I ended up playing with the card in decks that did not play blue. Just jammed fetches there and played the card. Maybe I overdid that a bit (that's what I thought at that time) but I learned that the decks became better with offcolor JVP.
When I started playing with JVP I wondered if this card is not better than Jace, the Mind Sculptor (or Lili). In vacuum JTMS is better but JVP is very versatile card that makes so many decks way better and since it costs two mana it can find home in more decks than JTMS. The card is just insane and even you can use its ultimate ability to win the game. That is something I did not even consider when I got so mesmerized by this card (that was pretty overlooked and underrated at that time). So I can't really say much about the card being 'over played'. I'm actually surprised that more people do not play the card.
I think that Jace, Vryn's Prodigy is not explored enough by many players. The card is very strong but very difficult to play with. Not that it would be easier to play with JTMS. I observed this when the card was legal in Standard.
I played 3 Ojutai's Commands, 3 Kolaghan's Commands, 4 JVPs ... just to simply have access to Jace. When the card managed to stay in play it just won the game! Similarly to how it was when people played Caw-Blade. I played Jace Beleren cards just to get rid of JTMS so I could land my own copy of JTMS and win. It took people long time to understand how ultimately good the card is (JTMS).
But don't worry you are not the only one. Many people do not like JVP and there is also many places JVP simply does not fit. I adore Snapcaster Mage and it was often the card I'd name 'my most favorite card' while I would never think of JVP. Sometimes there simply isn't room for Snapcaster Mage in a deck and other cards are better. When JTMS got banned I started playing Seagate Oracle to replace it^_^. I'd replace Snapcaster Mage with Preordain if I wouldn't have played 4 already or Flusterstorm/Spell Pierce. Because those are the effects Snapcaster Mage was good at. But it wasn't worth 3 mana and 2/1 body.
Note this is subjective and is my opinion but it all stems from my experience playing those cards and different decks^_^.
Thx for the comment. Glad you liked the article.
I think you are right. There is a likely bias in the responses. But since Lee is asking in the first place I guess there is some issue with attendence.
You logic sounds good. As I remember the popular opinion earlier on it was something like cross pod pairing would make no difference. Or maybe it was hate drafting would make no difference which might still be true.
Obviously I don't agree with the assertion that TWL is too much work to maintain. I do agree though that some moderate lip service to the casual crowd would probably have a far out of proportion positive impact, especially since we are starting to seem like an unwanted family member.
Not sure how I feel about the latest hot thing: Old school being the pick for this. Particularly since it is only partially online I see it as being less desirable than other possible formats but any challenging deck building format is going to be at least somewhat interesting at least until we discover how solved it is.
As to courage,O' Lion, it is within you. You simply must acknowledge what it is you truly want and you will find plenty of courage to get it done.
Interesting and indepth analysis of your evolution as a delver player. I like the term "switch deck". It sure beats the old timer "Aggro-Control" which is more about the role the player is in than the deck they are playing. (I like aggro control decks BECAUSE they are switch decks so why not call them that?) Brilliant nomenclature.
Question: since Delver is a tempo deck, and a switch deck is it fair to call it a 'Tempo Switch' deck?
I have to say, I absolutely loath Jace the Flippant. I don't know why precisely, but I do. From the very first I saw him, I said "that's a card I don't want to play." Maybe I am crazy. Seems like I'm in the minority at the very least. It is imho an over priced, over played hack of a card. But it does what it does so hey. On the other hand I adore snapcaster, even though it rarely brings the beat down in any meaningful way.
As per usual great read.
Thank you.
This may be more of a case where the ones opposed to cross-pod pairing are vocal and those that don't care are silent.
Logically it should be easier to 3-0 a pod by cutting the other drafters from the "best" deck, whereas in a league, the cream of many pods rises to the top, so you would face a top deck from another pod, rather than the 2nd best deck in your own pod.
Great article.
I saw Lee S ask on twitter why people dont like draft leagues. All answers point to a dislike for cross pod pairing.
We should get a revised opinion section on this. As far as I remember most comments here and on reddit suggested that cross pod pairing should not be an issue. Then why are people complaining?
A lot of the problem is that the bots can't acquire them directly; you have to play to get them. There are also a lot fewer cards overall, even compared to the LCPPs--and those packs didn't have many good Constructed-relevant new cards (though Meren has somehow risen to $24, despite the presumed lack of casual demand on MTGO). As for the cards themselves, I'm surprised Leovold is the most-expensive--people do realize rares and mythics are supposed to have the same rarity level, right? Atraxa is also another casual hit that apparently managed to have some value on MTGO.
(also, another reason prices might be so high is that MTGOTraders values having stock of basically every card, so it paid a premium to get that stock, and for some reason the price has held so far)
Ya,Enlightened Tutor prise drop a lot recently , thanks for EMA .
Whoa, I didn't even realize those were so expensive. Great idea putting them only into treasure chests, huh, Wizards?
Goblin and Elf are close to over their sustainable tipping points without their marquee cards. They'll come back a bit as other tribes take over and are pruned. Humans, of course, are so dense that they have a long way to go yet. But the system works. Pure is great since it's the only format that tribes like Kithkin or Treefolk will have a chance to be good in one day.
While I think Modern Tribal is probably fine as a format, I'd personally rather not replace Pure with it simply because of the additional cost of creating or refitting decks for a new format, plus losing access to the budget land-base of the Mirage fetches + cheap dual lands.
Maybe we could move the exiler illegality (and some other restrictions) to Underdog?
Or we could reform Pure as a fixed format rather than an evolving one (maybe with Human-Elf-Goblin outright banned as tribes), and alternate it with Modern.
Nah, taking on legacy decks with tribal decks is a great way to see how well you do in adverse conditions. If you can make it there, you can make it anywhere.
Leovold is missing from your Good Stuff list.
Atraxa and Recruiter of the Guard are less ridiculous but still ridiculous.
One upside of Modern is you can practice wit non-tribal players.
You get stomped when it's Legacy
I can't speak for Modern (sorry, something came up), but Pure feels very different to me than Regular. #1 reason is absence of Swords to Plowshares, #2 is legalitiy issues (many combos are flat out illegal under Pure) but there are several others.
Do you think Treasure Chests are going to keep being valuable? It seems like the prize content in them has increased lately and I wonder if that was a temporary move to generate some buzz about them. I don't dislike the idea completely, but I feel that the problem was that they were taking a known-value prize and swapping it for something that could be worthless. If the chests feel like a bonus, people will like them.
There is one other major issue with this approach though. Most of the new cards that have been released via Chests are worthless to constructed players and the few that are of interest to spikes are insanely expensive and hard to get right now. Everyone wants to finally test Leovold Emissary of Trest and it's over seventy tickets!
Yes. I missed those. My bad.