P2P1 – The Archers is the clear pick over Hunt-Pride IMO, and you didn’t even mention it. Did you overlook it, or am I just overvaluing it?
P2P3 – Not that you should be happy about taking it third, but the Kranioceros has the best chance of making your deck.
P2P4 – Just because the Ember Weaver has reach doesn’t make it a lot more defensive. After your Reborn picks fill out the red requirement, he will be a 3/3 first striker for 3! That’s arguably more aggressive than a 2/3 flyer for 3. I’m Ember Weaver all the way, here.
P2P7 – That’s a tough one. I don’t fault you for taking the creature, but with literally no mana fixing halfway through the draft, you are setting yourself up for either big mana problems, or having to forsake great pack-three spells to get some Borderposts.
P2P11 – Kranioceros made it around, nice. You may have to play him…
P3P1 – I faced that pick just the other day and went Pridemage, but it’s a tough call. I like that Pridemage can go down on T2 without a problem, and that it can deal with enchantments. Vithian doesn’t sac himself to do his thing, but can get stuck in hand, or get played with no targets. The clincher I think is that you have to be hoping for some borderposts in this pack, so he could sit uncastable in your hand if that happens.
P3P5 – I think Sureblade is fantastic, I like the pick. This is where maybe I’d trade an Aven Squire for a Sylvan Bounty so that I can take tasty spells over fixing in Reborn.
P3P6 – Total spot for the rare draft or the Leotau because Godtracker sucks.
P3P7 – Wow, crazy. Retaliator Griffin worked out really well for me in a recent draft it really becomes a must-kill guy for your opponent. Gloryscale is ridiculously sick in triple Reborn and I’d happily play him in your deck, but I don’t mind your pick. Hopefully some landcyclers make it around for you.
P3P9 – What a disciplined table. I take the ~$4 rare here. And Predatory Advantage definitely sucks.
After playing in numerous triple Reborn drafts, I have a new respect for Colossal Might. I'm still not sure it is better than lightning bolt or incinerate, but the trample part of it is nice. It is definitely better than I originally thought.
Great article I thought. I've been thinking about getting into Kscope but I didn't want to dump $100 in a format I'm just trying out. I might have to try this deck....
I agree with most of your picks pack 1, nice audible into Naya.
P1P7 excommunicate seems better than gift in an agressive deck.
end pack 1 playables
1cc: Necatal, A. Squire
2cc: R. Roar
3cc: Thunder, Thoctar, (pos. Gift)
4cc:
5cc: W. Guide, Bloodpyre
6+cc:
looking for 2 drops to round out an aggressive deck
P2P1: Temper, while less than ideal, is still removal. Or squire. over Hunt Pride.
P2P2: Nec. Outlander over Manaforce Mace
P2P3: Darklit Gargoyle, too early to hate, and you are not looking at black.
P2P8: Hate is fime here.
P2P9: It wheeled!!
end pack 2 playables
1cc: A. Squire, W. Necatal
2cc: Av. Squire x2
3cc: Thoctor, Thunder, Trailblazer
4cc: Meditant, Leotau
5cc: W. Guide, Bloodpyre
6+cc: Hunt Pride
would look for more 2 drops and some fixing as we are solidly 3 colors.
P3P1: or Pridemage is fine
P3P4: or Hushblede as you are low on 2 drops, but fixing is needed.
P3P5: Sureblade is correct
P3P6: Boarderpost for splash esp if you drafted Darklit Garg.
P3P7: Have not played w/ griffin, how good was it? I know Gloryscale can be ridic. good
Build:
-1 Knotvine
+1 Wild Leotau
(possibly)
-1 Sunseed
+1 Kranosaurous
Had you drafted a slightly more aggressine deck, you canoften take advantage of the slower 5color good stuff decks.
I understand why you pick vitian renegade before Thought Hemmorhage, but why take the deadshot minotaur infront of the 4 tickets card ?
I'm pretty sure a lot of people think like you since the thought hemmorhage fall in late pick, but i dont think the minotaur is a game changer worth a sure free pack.
I've tried the Nexus in a few decks, although it suffers a bit for not having any effect on the turn it is cast (Although you can get it into play with Lost Auramancers before you cast a spell). It's brilliant alongside Fist of Suns: Getting a 5-mana Progenitus to cascade is hilarious.
Another way for a cascade centric deck is to use Maelstrom Nexus. You can use Trace of Abundance to generate more mana and to fix mana, use Supply/Demand to fetch Nexus and then cast spells like Cruel Ultimatum or Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker as your first spell of the turn which could get you an Enlisted Wurm which then could get you a Bloodbraid Elf which then could get you.... you get the idea. That would be fun too.
As a true Vorthos I liked the Nicol Bolas deck a lot but it definately needs at least one copy of Elder Mastery just to make the deck "feel right".
A very nice article. I assume it is your first. While I do believe that you have to work on the format and the layout of the article, the content is nice and the way you talk about it is even nicer.
I can't say anything about the deck as budget decks (regardless the format) are not my strongest point. I guess I'm one of those "addicts, nerds and the obsessed". :)
I believe, even at the highest rules enforcement levels (ie Pro Tours), that if you draw a card before untapping your lands, no one takes mana burn, and there's no way to force someone to take mana burn. You might get a caution or a warning from a judge and the game is reset to your untap phase. Repeated offenses might lead to a game loss at that level.
Correct me if I am wrong on that, please.
When I began playing competitive magic, I got burned numerous times by bad declarations and mana tapping (not to mention biased judging). I learned and got better, but only through the school of hard knocks. Minimizing the knocks, while keeping the lessons, improves the playing experience for new players.
I play extended almost exclusively (excepting occasional drafts and sealed) now that I am back on Modo. I am a casual player by choice because I do not like the cutthroat style that is usually du jour in Tourney Practice. I prefer to chat when I play and relax. Thinking is a key element and I love to face decks that make me figure out how my pile of jank can deal with the threats and answers played.
Seeing a Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker hit the table does in many cases lead to a game loss. Either for me because I don't have the answer at hand or for my opponent because I do. Usually the former. Oblivion Ring is a half step answer. It can be defeated by itself (or enchantment removal or bounce or counters) and a superior draw.
The thing about Planeswalkers is not that they are a prison (I disagree on this) but that they are an eminent threat. Just like a Nevinnyrral's Disk is a threat/answer. They must be dealt with and quickly. If you let them hit their ultimate you will probably be conceding.
I just accept the planeswalkers as being overly expensive alternatives to facing other irritating decks (combos that go off turn 3, Counter Decks, LD decks etc). If you want to play them against me fine. If I see I have no chance I will concede and go onto the next. If you decide to play such a deck and can't be bothered with a Hello and Good luck! macro or Good Game Macro I probably won't play you twice. That is the thing about casual. It isn't forced on anyone.
Even the most obnoxious deck is excusable if played by someone you like. If fun was had playing with it or against it...all is well. That's my 2.5 cents on this subject.
Whether or not card designs like Planeswalkers lead to people quitting? well that has been true for any number of unpopular decisions (Slivers? Urza's Cycle? etc). I imagine that in 20 years the same game will still be around even if the players have changed. It is viral and not going anywhere but up.
Maybe you're right Matt, and that is a good perspective. But you have to keep a couple things in mind. While minor rules changes may seem insignificant in a casual environment, it has a major effect on the higher level tournaments.
If I'm playing in a casual game and my opponent draws a card before he untaps his land, am I going to make him take mana burn? No! That's ridiculous, it was a simple/common mistake. Now on the other hand, if I'm playing in a HUGE tourney and a butt load of money is on the line, that's a different story. Especially when you have to consider the fact that you can only get so good at magic before it comes down to pure luck and the most seemingly insignificant rules of the game. Once you learn how to pilot a deck, and you figure out what is the most "statisticly" proper choice you are supossed to make in a given situation, then the rest is up to luck. That, and my personal favorite... the rouge deck. But that is a totally different arguement altogether.
And land-tapping shouldn't be a skill. Anyone who has the skill "great land-tapper" should be a Pokemon player.
I disagree with the armorguard assessment for pauper. I think it could be used in slivers to improve the mirror.
sigil of the nayan gods could see play in token decks and there have been some in pauper to make a small splash.
colossal might seems like a pretty beefy card in pauper, that can speed up your clock to the point where you can kill before the rats eats your team of 3/3 dorks
Yeah vote parties are hard to deal with, I heard that when Jerry Springer was on dancing with the stars a view radio personalities kept urging people to vote for him. And he stayed on well past his prime.
I agree that interactive is fun, maybe if it required unique login, with unique email address to vote. At least then vote parties will be harder to pull off, and further restrictions like active users that have at least made 5 comments on other entries can vote. Might not be the best solution but feasible.
Panel judging will give people their own set of gripes, but at least it's fair.
We're doing the judge panel and voting much like american idol is doing. Also much like American Idol, people are having vote parties, and AT&T are showing people how to power text.
For future contests, I am not sure. We'll prolly go on to the judge panel only thing, but I hate that. WOTC does it, with the building decks for old sets contests, and I have never seen wotc explain why that deck won. (I'm not bagging on WOTC, I just want the site to be as interactive as possible.)
See you on the battlefield! too bad we lost "summon", is a good word. summon morgue toad to the battlefield.
LadyV's tips for the next name changes... graveyard to become mausoleum, library to spellbook, and most likely player to something else... they seem to be giving everything a fantasy feel, and then have "player". im lobbying for it to be Goddess. Fireball deals x damage to target goddess
P1P8 – Hissing Iguanar is my pick here.
P2P1 – The Archers is the clear pick over Hunt-Pride IMO, and you didn’t even mention it. Did you overlook it, or am I just overvaluing it?
P2P3 – Not that you should be happy about taking it third, but the Kranioceros has the best chance of making your deck.
P2P4 – Just because the Ember Weaver has reach doesn’t make it a lot more defensive. After your Reborn picks fill out the red requirement, he will be a 3/3 first striker for 3! That’s arguably more aggressive than a 2/3 flyer for 3. I’m Ember Weaver all the way, here.
P2P7 – That’s a tough one. I don’t fault you for taking the creature, but with literally no mana fixing halfway through the draft, you are setting yourself up for either big mana problems, or having to forsake great pack-three spells to get some Borderposts.
P2P11 – Kranioceros made it around, nice. You may have to play him…
P3P1 – I faced that pick just the other day and went Pridemage, but it’s a tough call. I like that Pridemage can go down on T2 without a problem, and that it can deal with enchantments. Vithian doesn’t sac himself to do his thing, but can get stuck in hand, or get played with no targets. The clincher I think is that you have to be hoping for some borderposts in this pack, so he could sit uncastable in your hand if that happens.
P3P5 – I think Sureblade is fantastic, I like the pick. This is where maybe I’d trade an Aven Squire for a Sylvan Bounty so that I can take tasty spells over fixing in Reborn.
P3P6 – Total spot for the rare draft or the Leotau because Godtracker sucks.
P3P7 – Wow, crazy. Retaliator Griffin worked out really well for me in a recent draft it really becomes a must-kill guy for your opponent. Gloryscale is ridiculously sick in triple Reborn and I’d happily play him in your deck, but I don’t mind your pick. Hopefully some landcyclers make it around for you.
P3P9 – What a disciplined table. I take the ~$4 rare here. And Predatory Advantage definitely sucks.
After playing in numerous triple Reborn drafts, I have a new respect for Colossal Might. I'm still not sure it is better than lightning bolt or incinerate, but the trample part of it is nice. It is definitely better than I originally thought.
Great article I thought. I've been thinking about getting into Kscope but I didn't want to dump $100 in a format I'm just trying out. I might have to try this deck....
I agree with most of your picks pack 1, nice audible into Naya.
P1P7 excommunicate seems better than gift in an agressive deck.
end pack 1 playables
1cc: Necatal, A. Squire
2cc: R. Roar
3cc: Thunder, Thoctar, (pos. Gift)
4cc:
5cc: W. Guide, Bloodpyre
6+cc:
looking for 2 drops to round out an aggressive deck
P2P1: Temper, while less than ideal, is still removal. Or squire. over Hunt Pride.
P2P2: Nec. Outlander over Manaforce Mace
P2P3: Darklit Gargoyle, too early to hate, and you are not looking at black.
P2P8: Hate is fime here.
P2P9: It wheeled!!
end pack 2 playables
1cc: A. Squire, W. Necatal
2cc: Av. Squire x2
3cc: Thoctor, Thunder, Trailblazer
4cc: Meditant, Leotau
5cc: W. Guide, Bloodpyre
6+cc: Hunt Pride
would look for more 2 drops and some fixing as we are solidly 3 colors.
P3P1: or Pridemage is fine
P3P4: or Hushblede as you are low on 2 drops, but fixing is needed.
P3P5: Sureblade is correct
P3P6: Boarderpost for splash esp if you drafted Darklit Garg.
P3P7: Have not played w/ griffin, how good was it? I know Gloryscale can be ridic. good
Build:
-1 Knotvine
+1 Wild Leotau
(possibly)
-1 Sunseed
+1 Kranosaurous
Had you drafted a slightly more aggressine deck, you canoften take advantage of the slower 5color good stuff decks.
regards,
___helper_monkey on MODO
I understand why you pick vitian renegade before Thought Hemmorhage, but why take the deadshot minotaur infront of the 4 tickets card ?
I'm pretty sure a lot of people think like you since the thought hemmorhage fall in late pick, but i dont think the minotaur is a game changer worth a sure free pack.
I've tried the Nexus in a few decks, although it suffers a bit for not having any effect on the turn it is cast (Although you can get it into play with Lost Auramancers before you cast a spell). It's brilliant alongside Fist of Suns: Getting a 5-mana Progenitus to cascade is hilarious.
Pretty decent debut article. I operate on a fairly negligible budget myself (With the occasional exception), so I can appreciate the perspective.
If you're keeping the cost down why not Salt Marsh instead of Frost Marsh?
Another way for a cascade centric deck is to use Maelstrom Nexus. You can use Trace of Abundance to generate more mana and to fix mana, use Supply/Demand to fetch Nexus and then cast spells like Cruel Ultimatum or Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker as your first spell of the turn which could get you an Enlisted Wurm which then could get you a Bloodbraid Elf which then could get you.... you get the idea. That would be fun too.
As a true Vorthos I liked the Nicol Bolas deck a lot but it definately needs at least one copy of Elder Mastery just to make the deck "feel right".
LE
both a creature and a planeswalker.
Planeswalkers aren't creatures
Nice article. I really like the writing style. Keep them coming.
A very nice article. I assume it is your first. While I do believe that you have to work on the format and the layout of the article, the content is nice and the way you talk about it is even nicer.
I can't say anything about the deck as budget decks (regardless the format) are not my strongest point. I guess I'm one of those "addicts, nerds and the obsessed". :)
Well done!
LE
I believe, even at the highest rules enforcement levels (ie Pro Tours), that if you draw a card before untapping your lands, no one takes mana burn, and there's no way to force someone to take mana burn. You might get a caution or a warning from a judge and the game is reset to your untap phase. Repeated offenses might lead to a game loss at that level.
Correct me if I am wrong on that, please.
When I began playing competitive magic, I got burned numerous times by bad declarations and mana tapping (not to mention biased judging). I learned and got better, but only through the school of hard knocks. Minimizing the knocks, while keeping the lessons, improves the playing experience for new players.
I don't agree with Manaforce Mace over Beacon Behemoth. Otherwise seems like a decent draft.
I have seen the shock lands go for as low as 2 tix in auction at certain times recently. I am not saying it happens all the time but it has happened.
"For example you could spend less then a ticket on Frost Marsh or four times as much on Watery Grave."
I want to buy a Watery Grave for 4 tix.
More on topic, thanks for the article. Love budget primers/
OTL
those are gonna take some getting used to. *sigh*
U/W oath is something the wife played back in vintage, and I cant wait to make use of it again.
you just reminded me to go buy forbidden orchards while the price is low
I play extended almost exclusively (excepting occasional drafts and sealed) now that I am back on Modo. I am a casual player by choice because I do not like the cutthroat style that is usually du jour in Tourney Practice. I prefer to chat when I play and relax. Thinking is a key element and I love to face decks that make me figure out how my pile of jank can deal with the threats and answers played.
Seeing a Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker hit the table does in many cases lead to a game loss. Either for me because I don't have the answer at hand or for my opponent because I do. Usually the former. Oblivion Ring is a half step answer. It can be defeated by itself (or enchantment removal or bounce or counters) and a superior draw.
The thing about Planeswalkers is not that they are a prison (I disagree on this) but that they are an eminent threat. Just like a Nevinnyrral's Disk is a threat/answer. They must be dealt with and quickly. If you let them hit their ultimate you will probably be conceding.
I just accept the planeswalkers as being overly expensive alternatives to facing other irritating decks (combos that go off turn 3, Counter Decks, LD decks etc). If you want to play them against me fine. If I see I have no chance I will concede and go onto the next. If you decide to play such a deck and can't be bothered with a Hello and Good luck! macro or Good Game Macro I probably won't play you twice. That is the thing about casual. It isn't forced on anyone.
Even the most obnoxious deck is excusable if played by someone you like. If fun was had playing with it or against it...all is well. That's my 2.5 cents on this subject.
Whether or not card designs like Planeswalkers lead to people quitting? well that has been true for any number of unpopular decisions (Slivers? Urza's Cycle? etc). I imagine that in 20 years the same game will still be around even if the players have changed. It is viral and not going anywhere but up.
Maybe you're right Matt, and that is a good perspective. But you have to keep a couple things in mind. While minor rules changes may seem insignificant in a casual environment, it has a major effect on the higher level tournaments.
If I'm playing in a casual game and my opponent draws a card before he untaps his land, am I going to make him take mana burn? No! That's ridiculous, it was a simple/common mistake. Now on the other hand, if I'm playing in a HUGE tourney and a butt load of money is on the line, that's a different story. Especially when you have to consider the fact that you can only get so good at magic before it comes down to pure luck and the most seemingly insignificant rules of the game. Once you learn how to pilot a deck, and you figure out what is the most "statisticly" proper choice you are supossed to make in a given situation, then the rest is up to luck. That, and my personal favorite... the rouge deck. But that is a totally different arguement altogether.
And land-tapping shouldn't be a skill. Anyone who has the skill "great land-tapper" should be a Pokemon player.
I disagree with the armorguard assessment for pauper. I think it could be used in slivers to improve the mirror.
sigil of the nayan gods could see play in token decks and there have been some in pauper to make a small splash.
colossal might seems like a pretty beefy card in pauper, that can speed up your clock to the point where you can kill before the rats eats your team of 3/3 dorks
Yeah vote parties are hard to deal with, I heard that when Jerry Springer was on dancing with the stars a view radio personalities kept urging people to vote for him. And he stayed on well past his prime.
I agree that interactive is fun, maybe if it required unique login, with unique email address to vote. At least then vote parties will be harder to pull off, and further restrictions like active users that have at least made 5 comments on other entries can vote. Might not be the best solution but feasible.
Panel judging will give people their own set of gripes, but at least it's fair.
We're doing the judge panel and voting much like american idol is doing. Also much like American Idol, people are having vote parties, and AT&T are showing people how to power text.
For future contests, I am not sure. We'll prolly go on to the judge panel only thing, but I hate that. WOTC does it, with the building decks for old sets contests, and I have never seen wotc explain why that deck won. (I'm not bagging on WOTC, I just want the site to be as interactive as possible.)
I like the new names lol
See you on the battlefield! too bad we lost "summon", is a good word. summon morgue toad to the battlefield.
LadyV's tips for the next name changes... graveyard to become mausoleum, library to spellbook, and most likely player to something else... they seem to be giving everything a fantasy feel, and then have "player". im lobbying for it to be Goddess. Fireball deals x damage to target goddess