Wotc has way more to do with formats "dying" or "thriving" than anyone thinks.
When VMA came out, that set and Vintage were heavily promoted. The VSL went on, people played the format. Support waned, and so did the player base.
People started trying to promote the format, then Wotc helps with a big event, and people start playing. Imagine how much more would happen if they found a way to do a paper Vintage Grand Prix (card availability is an issue, but GPs also don't have to always have 5,000 people as far as I'm concerned).
When Wotc cut block constructed from Pro Tours, and tried to nuke Modern as well, people got upset and rightly so. I think that was their attempt to just make Magic 90% Standard and Draft (instead of the 75% it probably is now). I get why they'd shred Modern, it doesn't sell as much product for them. Block does though, so that just doesn't make sense.
In my opinion, Magic needs things like Vintage, Block, Legacy, Tribal Wars, Commander, ALL OF IT. Why? Because they print so many cards, we need places for more cards to shine! I don't know about you, but it bothers me to look at my Magic collection. I have very few cards left compared to most people, but most of what I do have is bulk and just plain trash. The fact that 15 card packs are 95% worthless trash most of the time (as far as Standard goes) is at least somewhat mitigated by the idea that some of those cards could make it into someone's pauper deck, or cube, or commander deck, whatever.
I agree with you that Block is a great way for someone to start off in MTGO, in fact I've heard Brad Nelson say the same thing. I'm all for anything that lets someone play with less financial effort. This game should be an intellectual endeavor, not a money contest. Now if they can just lower the cost of Standard decks, I would be even happier.
Deluxeicoff, thanks for the comment! Innistrad is my favorite block and I would love it if Wizards returned to that Plane every couple years. I don't see too many people being disappointed in that.
CottonRhetoric, I try to squeeze Chiller into everything as much as I possibly can.
FWIW, I Tweeted directly to Aaron Forsythe. I indicated that, as an autistic adult, I've found a lot of support in this community, and cannot believe Legacy Tribal Wars will be discontinued in less than a month.
Great angle and mood to this gem! I wish MTG had more 'creepy dolls'...they could be 0/1 totems, and then....(perhaps when you're not looking...say an untap phase...) opp loses half their life!
Ugh, I certainly hope that's not the reasoning behind this; that would be the absolute worst possible response I can imagine to the challenge that Hearthstone presents. The near endless variety is MTG's greatest strength and sleekness and straightforwardness is Hearthstone's greatest strength; to de-emphasise what their own product does well and attempt to fight a competitor at it's own best feature seems like a fantastic way to guarantee MTGO's failure.
Battle stations once more. Our format needs us, so spread the word far and wide. Make your voices heard across all the myriad media Wizards have supplanted their forums with.
This is relevant to the entire client, so we use the #mtgo hashtag. If people want to look it up they should see wall to wall comments on this unwarranted change.
Perhaps most importantly, Here is where Aaron Forsythe gave his word that we would, and I quote, 'Never be without a format to call your own.' Wizards of the Coast has suffered greatly for the sake of keeping its word: The only reason the Reserved List still exists is because a similar pledge is still being upheld. Never let them forget what they have committed to.
I don't play any of the formats they listed but it makes me very angry. My favorite format isn't the most popular, so I've experienced some prior feelings of neglect (not nearly as much though).
There's a huge portion of magic cards not quite good enough for standard, modern, legacy, or vintage . Some of those cards have some demand based on their playability in pauper, commander, tribal, etc. That's one reason to keep other formats alive.
Then there's the fact that tribal players are paying customers and deserve respect. Same for all other formats.
Yeah, I have a feeling that they are trying to streamline MTGO, kind of make it more like Hearthstone, where you don't have as much choice and everything is more restricted. The chat is worse than it was on V3, they are cutting the formats, and the reappearance of leagues is actually sort of in line with that - a fast, streamlined way to play any time you have a little time. Similiar thing with player points which allow players to jump from events to events without needing to bother with bots so much. I am not saying this is bad, but they are unfortunately also trying to limit other forms of player "improvisation" by eliminating lots of options. Everything seems to be becoming more simplistic, like some kind of a video game.
They did. It is a disgrace. And yet the pieces are falling into place as to why they are reneging on their promise. They are killing casual magic on mtgo and that is backed up not just by the clearing out of all these formats but also how they are selling (or not selling) their products on mtgo. Commander decks which go back to 2011 are removed from the store and this years versions will not be sold at all. To get those cards one will have to either buy/trade for the cards on the secondary market or by playing the Legendary Cube drafts (which imho seem awful based on the description.)
I wish it were not the case but it seems that WOTC hates casual magic and its players. They are breaking the kitchen tables.
"That's where you, the public, come in. You spoke and we heard. Your Specter and Volver and Sliver decks will never be without a format to call their own."
Didn't they promise last time when they took it down and then back up after the public outcry that we will always have our format or something like that?
I guess it is not a coincidence that the forums are closing before this so we have no place to voice a reasoned argument against this. (140character bytes are not enough space.)
I built a de Pietro deck a few years ago to compete in the sunday Edh chaos tourney. It was pretty meh but I think I still did OK with it. As I remember one pod was me with the pirate, vs Scion of Justice, the TO (whose name escapes me now) +1. It was a fairly hairy contest full of blunders on my part. I just remember Scion's deck was full of Shadowmage Infiltrator type of cards and combos. Attack and draw and the TO's deck had a Naya theme full of cheap powerful creatures.
Without checking what year it was, I started playing mtgo when Future Sight was the latest set. Currently I play Vintage Dailies, Cube drafts, Modern Dailies and sometimes 8mans or Leagues. I played Release Sealeds when they are available and sometimes I join a PPTQ.
I also have newer accounts that I almost never play on and I didn't get it on those either.
Last time I was in the closed beta was during the testing of Vintage Masters. I guess that is in between you and Paul. I have not heard Pete talking about being a beta tester recently either.
We/I like to have a Vintage event per year, and Halloween is the safest environment, since most power tribes aren't allowed, so there's only so much damage one can do with Moxen and stuff there.
Wotc has way more to do with formats "dying" or "thriving" than anyone thinks.
When VMA came out, that set and Vintage were heavily promoted. The VSL went on, people played the format. Support waned, and so did the player base.
People started trying to promote the format, then Wotc helps with a big event, and people start playing. Imagine how much more would happen if they found a way to do a paper Vintage Grand Prix (card availability is an issue, but GPs also don't have to always have 5,000 people as far as I'm concerned).
When Wotc cut block constructed from Pro Tours, and tried to nuke Modern as well, people got upset and rightly so. I think that was their attempt to just make Magic 90% Standard and Draft (instead of the 75% it probably is now). I get why they'd shred Modern, it doesn't sell as much product for them. Block does though, so that just doesn't make sense.
In my opinion, Magic needs things like Vintage, Block, Legacy, Tribal Wars, Commander, ALL OF IT. Why? Because they print so many cards, we need places for more cards to shine! I don't know about you, but it bothers me to look at my Magic collection. I have very few cards left compared to most people, but most of what I do have is bulk and just plain trash. The fact that 15 card packs are 95% worthless trash most of the time (as far as Standard goes) is at least somewhat mitigated by the idea that some of those cards could make it into someone's pauper deck, or cube, or commander deck, whatever.
I agree with you that Block is a great way for someone to start off in MTGO, in fact I've heard Brad Nelson say the same thing. I'm all for anything that lets someone play with less financial effort. This game should be an intellectual endeavor, not a money contest. Now if they can just lower the cost of Standard decks, I would be even happier.
Yep with Nelson and Lefty(George and Roy) gone The Wilburys are no more but their music lives on.
Deluxeicoff, thanks for the comment! Innistrad is my favorite block and I would love it if Wizards returned to that Plane every couple years. I don't see too many people being disappointed in that.
CottonRhetoric, I try to squeeze Chiller into everything as much as I possibly can.
I will need to reread this to soak all of this in. But I will say you are definitely one of the past masters of combo I enjoy reading stuff from.
Chiller truly is the best font.
FWIW, I Tweeted directly to Aaron Forsythe. I indicated that, as an autistic adult, I've found a lot of support in this community, and cannot believe Legacy Tribal Wars will be discontinued in less than a month.
Great angle and mood to this gem! I wish MTG had more 'creepy dolls'...they could be 0/1 totems, and then....(perhaps when you're not looking...say an untap phase...) opp loses half their life!
Given the current crisis, I would suggest that not using the Legacy Tribal Wars format for an event might be a bad idea.
Might be worth tweeting at Aaron Forsythe directly to point out that WotC is reneging on his promise.
Ugh, I certainly hope that's not the reasoning behind this; that would be the absolute worst possible response I can imagine to the challenge that Hearthstone presents. The near endless variety is MTG's greatest strength and sleekness and straightforwardness is Hearthstone's greatest strength; to de-emphasise what their own product does well and attempt to fight a competitor at it's own best feature seems like a fantastic way to guarantee MTGO's failure.
Battle stations once more. Our format needs us, so spread the word far and wide. Make your voices heard across all the myriad media Wizards have supplanted their forums with.
Email: magiconlinefeedback@wizards.com
Be polite, clear, respectful, determined and loud. Fill this inbox to the bursting point.
Reddit:
https://www.reddit.com/r/MTGO/comments/3qgjp3/wotc_is_gutting_the_format...
https://www.reddit.com/r/magicTCG/comments/3qhebn/wotc_is_gutting_the_ma...
This needs to be too big to ignore, to obvious to brush under the carpet.
Tumblr:
http://wizardsmtgo.tumblr.com/
Use the 'Ask me anything' link.
Twitter:
https://twitter.com/hashtag/mtgo
This is relevant to the entire client, so we use the #mtgo hashtag. If people want to look it up they should see wall to wall comments on this unwarranted change.
Now, references and tools.
Don't give up heart: Here is where we rallied to save the format last time it was threatened. Do now what we did then.
http://puremtgo.com/articles/diaries-apocalypse-tribal-week-162
Perhaps most importantly, Here is where Aaron Forsythe gave his word that we would, and I quote, 'Never be without a format to call your own.' Wizards of the Coast has suffered greatly for the sake of keeping its word: The only reason the Reserved List still exists is because a similar pledge is still being upheld. Never let them forget what they have committed to.
http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/latest-developments/simic-e...
I don't play any of the formats they listed but it makes me very angry. My favorite format isn't the most popular, so I've experienced some prior feelings of neglect (not nearly as much though).
There's a huge portion of magic cards not quite good enough for standard, modern, legacy, or vintage . Some of those cards have some demand based on their playability in pauper, commander, tribal, etc. That's one reason to keep other formats alive.
Then there's the fact that tribal players are paying customers and deserve respect. Same for all other formats.
Dust of your pitchforks, folks. use the hashtag #SaveLegacyTribalWars
This is bull[expletive redacted]
Yeah, I have a feeling that they are trying to streamline MTGO, kind of make it more like Hearthstone, where you don't have as much choice and everything is more restricted. The chat is worse than it was on V3, they are cutting the formats, and the reappearance of leagues is actually sort of in line with that - a fast, streamlined way to play any time you have a little time. Similiar thing with player points which allow players to jump from events to events without needing to bother with bots so much. I am not saying this is bad, but they are unfortunately also trying to limit other forms of player "improvisation" by eliminating lots of options. Everything seems to be becoming more simplistic, like some kind of a video game.
They did. It is a disgrace. And yet the pieces are falling into place as to why they are reneging on their promise. They are killing casual magic on mtgo and that is backed up not just by the clearing out of all these formats but also how they are selling (or not selling) their products on mtgo. Commander decks which go back to 2011 are removed from the store and this years versions will not be sold at all. To get those cards one will have to either buy/trade for the cards on the secondary market or by playing the Legendary Cube drafts (which imho seem awful based on the description.)
I wish it were not the case but it seems that WOTC hates casual magic and its players. They are breaking the kitchen tables.
Apparently they promised it before that, when they first tried to cancel it, as AJ Impy pointed out in this thread:
http://community.wizards.com/forum/magic-online-general/threads/4052086
"That's where you, the public, come in. You spoke and we heard. Your Specter and Volver and Sliver decks will never be without a format to call their own."
This sucks.
Didn't they promise last time when they took it down and then back up after the public outcry that we will always have our format or something like that?
I guess it is not a coincidence that the forums are closing before this so we have no place to voice a reasoned argument against this. (140character bytes are not enough space.)
Wizard is once again removing Legacy Tribal Wars from MTGO on 11th November 2015.
http://magic.wizards.com/en/MTGO/articles/archive/magic-online/magic-onl...
I built a de Pietro deck a few years ago to compete in the sunday Edh chaos tourney. It was pretty meh but I think I still did OK with it. As I remember one pod was me with the pirate, vs Scion of Justice, the TO (whose name escapes me now) +1. It was a fairly hairy contest full of blunders on my part. I just remember Scion's deck was full of Shadowmage Infiltrator type of cards and combos. Attack and draw and the TO's deck had a Naya theme full of cheap powerful creatures.
Without checking what year it was, I started playing mtgo when Future Sight was the latest set. Currently I play Vintage Dailies, Cube drafts, Modern Dailies and sometimes 8mans or Leagues. I played Release Sealeds when they are available and sometimes I join a PPTQ.
I also have newer accounts that I almost never play on and I didn't get it on those either.
Last time I was in the closed beta was during the testing of Vintage Masters. I guess that is in between you and Paul. I have not heard Pete talking about being a beta tester recently either.
We/I like to have a Vintage event per year, and Halloween is the safest environment, since most power tribes aren't allowed, so there's only so much damage one can do with Moxen and stuff there.
It's because he registered with an alternative account, The.Sensei (currently at #53).
Rom's humans list looks like a blast to play. Swords + Rhinos!